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topic #2820

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Subject: "Car Stalling Out"

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Aggression	Dec-15-06 04:02 AM
Old School 2GNTer 3025 posts,

#2820, "Car Stalling Out"

Ok well my car has been sitting for about 3 months now due to me needing to replace my DP.

During the down time I've done the following:

1. Replace my heater hoses back by the firewall

2. Switched from a 16g to a 20g

3. Had a stock 3g muffler welded on my 3" exhuast

4. Updated my MS firmware

Now...what happens is I start the car and it will idle fine and if I go to drive it, it will stall out within a minute or 2. If I just let it sit and idle long enough...it will stall out as well.

I datalogged the symptom at idle and there is a point right before it stalls were my map signal and my rpms cross and my rpms go way up and my map signal shoots way down. I will post a screen shot of it tonight. Almost looks like the map does a reflection effect of the RPM if that makes any sense.

Why is it stalling out all the sudden? I didn't do anything out of the ordinary for this to happen. Could my IAT sensor be failing?

Also after the car stalls out, I can't restart the car for at least 5 mins after it stalls. And this is true for everytime it stalls.

I know it has to be MS related.

All help is appreciated!

--------------------

- 05 Subaru STi
- 97 eclipse gs (289whp w/ 276tq)

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Replies to this topic

RE: Car Stalling Out, Administrator

Administrator

Star Turbo Talon, Dec-16-06 07:31 PM, #1

RE: Car Stalling Out, Aggression, Dec-20-06 08:44 AM, #2

RE: Car Stalling Out, Team

Team

XtremeRS, Dec-21-06 04:11 AM, #3

RE: Car Stalling Out, Aggression, Dec-21-06 01:48 PM, #4

RE: Car Stalling Out, BlackMagic, Dec-22-06 11:14 AM, #5

RE: Car Stalling Out, Aggression, Dec-26-06 10:59 AM, #6

RE: Car Stalling Out, BlackMagic, Dec-26-06 11:04 AM, #7

RE: Car Stalling Out, wite96gs, Jan-04-07 03:17 PM, #8

RE: Car Stalling Out, Aggression, Jan-08-07 03:40 AM, #9

RE: Car Stalling Out, WickedESi, Jan-08-07 04:59 AM, #10

RE: Car Stalling Out, Aggression, Jan-08-07 06:05 AM, #11

RE: Car Stalling Out, Aggression, Jan-09-07 05:16 AM, #12

RE: Car Stalling Out, WickedESi, Jan-09-07 05:33 AM, #13

RE: Car Stalling Out, wite96gs, Jan-09-07 01:25 PM, #14

RE: Car Stalling Out, Aggression, Jan-10-07 02:05 AM, #15

RE: Car Stalling Out, wite96gs, Jan-10-07 05:21 AM, #16

RE: Car Stalling Out, customrsturbo, Jan-10-07 03:35 PM, #17

RE: Car Stalling Out, Aggression, Jan-11-07 02:40 AM, #18

RE: Car Stalling Out, wite96gs, Jan-12-07 07:38 AM, #19

RE: Car Stalling Out, customrsturbo, Jan-12-07 09:51 AM, #20

RE: Car Stalling Out, Aggression, Jan-15-07 02:22 AM, #21

RE: Car Stalling Out, wite96gs, Jan-15-07 05:36 AM, #22

RE: Car Stalling Out, customrsturbo, Jan-15-07 08:49 AM, #23

RE: Car Stalling Out, Aggression, Jan-16-07 01:46 AM, #24

RE: Car Stalling Out, customrsturbo, Jan-16-07 03:39 AM, #25

RE: Car Stalling Out, wite96gs, Jan-16-07 05:20 AM, #26

RE: Car Stalling Out, customrsturbo, Jan-16-07 06:58 AM, #27

Star Turbo Talon	Dec-16-06 07:31 PM
Member since Oct 21st 2003 8331 posts,

#2835, "RE: Car Stalling Out"
In response to Reply # 0

I would reload the previous firmware to see if the issue continues. The amount of fuel being injected also affects your map value. I am not quite sure whats going on but since you just loaded a newer firmware, i would revert back to the original you had and try that.

Terry

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Aggression	Dec-20-06 08:44 AM
Old School 2GNTer 3025 posts,

#2843, "RE: Car Stalling Out"
In response to Reply # 1

Well I didn't go back to my normal firmware as of yet. I did pull out my IAC sensor and the little probe in it was gone. I replaced it and now my car runs ULTRA LEAN! I mean 19.9. Since day one it hasn't held a tune...it just keeps falling out of tune really fast and doesn't seem to work very well.

I have been having nothing but issues with it since I purchased it. I am thinking about going with a portfueler here very soon if this keeps up.

--------------------

- 05 Subaru STi
- 97 eclipse gs (289whp w/ 276tq)

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XtremeRS	Dec-21-06 04:11 AM
Member since May 20th 2003 6329 posts,

#2844, "RE: Car Stalling Out"
In response to Reply # 2

What firmware did you upgrade to? When an engine is starting to chug or die out, you will notice that the map will get higher(engine pulls very little vac when its running bad)closer to 100 kpa, so that sounds somewhat normal..I would go through ALL of you settings in Megatune to be sure nothing got skewed when you did the firmware change. Sometimes a few settings can get off when upgrading. Especially check the closed loop perameters, as you your o2 settings may have changed, and the ECU is trying to run super lean. Verify you have all the settings the way they should be, then go from there.

13.5 @108 MPH-2.2 60ft(stupid FWD!)
S16G @ 18 PSI/FMIC/Running on MegaSquirt II (Now with sequential
fuel injection)
My webpage: http://eclipsed4evr.home.comcast.net
-1998 Mitsubishi Eclipse RS-T- "Toy"
-1992 Plymouth Laser Turbo AWD(SOLD)
-2000 Honda CR-V(daily)

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Aggression	Dec-21-06 01:48 PM
Old School 2GNTer 3025 posts,

#2845, "RE: Car Stalling Out"
In response to Reply # 3

I'll take a look and see if any of the settings have changed. Thanks for the heads up.

--------------------

- 05 Subaru STi
- 97 eclipse gs (289whp w/ 276tq)

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BlackMagic	Dec-22-06 11:14 AM
Donating 2GNT member 1243 posts,

#2850, "RE: Car Stalling Out"
In response to Reply # 4

What I did before changing over to the 029t firmware was take screenshots of all of my settings so I could make sure nothing changed.

_____________________________________

http://www.dsmregistry.com/detail.php?carid=1133
*form follows function*

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Aggression	Dec-26-06 10:59 AM
Old School 2GNTer 3025 posts,

#2853, "RE: Car Stalling Out"
In response to Reply # 5

Did you notice any settings that changed?

--------------------

- 05 Subaru STi
- 97 eclipse gs (289whp w/ 276tq)

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BlackMagic	Dec-26-06 11:04 AM
Donating 2GNT member 1243 posts,

#2854, "RE: Car Stalling Out"
In response to Reply # 6

All of my accel enrichment settings got changed.

_____________________________________

http://www.dsmregistry.com/detail.php?carid=1133
*form follows function*

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wite96gs	Jan-04-07 03:17 PM
Member since Mar 20th 2004 365 posts,

#2865, "RE: Car Stalling Out"
In response to Reply # 5

Originally posted by BlackMagic
What I did before changing over to the 029t firmware was take screenshots of all of my settings so I could make sure nothing changed.

That's a damn good idea

-----------
the first solution that comes to mind for any new problem with my car usually involves a can of bad gas and a match...

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Aggression	Jan-08-07 03:40 AM
Old School 2GNTer 3025 posts,

#2868, "RE: Car Stalling Out"
In response to Reply # 8

yes it is...I should of done it, but never expected it to switch setting like that. Guess I learned my leason.

Car is still stalling out and no idea why. It seems that its temperature related, but I'm not 100% sure why. Reason I want to think that is cause the car will start up and and idle fine now that we adjusted the VE Fuel table so its not super lean anymore. But after my coolant temp reaches about 200 the car shuts off, and then I can't restart the car until it cools down a bit.

Now I am not 100% sure its that, its just a hunch due to the symptoms.

It really seems everything started going haywire after the update to the O29T firmware.

If I don't get this figured out this week, I will have to pull the MSnS and purchase a portfueler. My car has been down for 4 months now and its my daily driver so I can't realy sink any money into getting a daily to only sink more into it to keep it running....otherwise my car will never see the road again. I need to fix my car now.

I know its the MSnS and I am starting to beleive its not for me.

--------------------

- 05 Subaru STi
- 97 eclipse gs (289whp w/ 276tq)

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WickedESi	Jan-08-07 04:59 AM
Donating 2GNT member 3090 posts,

#2869, "RE: Car Stalling Out"
In response to Reply # 9

Was it running fine on the old firmware? Switch it back, then mess with the new when you have time.

You're brave to MS and all the custom work to your daily driver. As much as I really want to, (with my past experience) I don't think I could recommend that.

Joel Baldridge, ASE Certified Master Technician, Audi Certified Expert Technician

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Aggression	Jan-08-07 06:05 AM
Old School 2GNTer 3025 posts,

#2870, "RE: Car Stalling Out"
In response to Reply # 10

Originally posted by WickedESi
Was it running fine on the old firmware?

Yes...just a few issues with the warmup enrichments.

Originally posted by WickedESiSwitch it back, then mess with the new when you have time.

I think I am going to try that next cause I've been reading up on msefi that tons of people are having issues with the 029 q,t,v firmware. Your settings can be dead on but it interperts it differently for some reason. Not really sure why...just seems like that is what the bug is.

Originally posted by WickedESiYou're brave to MS and all the custom work to your daily driver. As much as I really want to, (with my past experience) I don't think I could recommend that.

I really don't have the money to buy a daily driver as of right now.

--------------------

- 05 Subaru STi
- 97 eclipse gs (289whp w/ 276tq)

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Aggression	Jan-09-07 05:16 AM
Old School 2GNTer 3025 posts,

#2872, "RE: Car Stalling Out"
In response to Reply # 3

Originally posted by XtremeRS
What firmware did you upgrade to? When an engine is starting to chug or die out, you will notice that the map will get higher(engine pulls very little vac when its running bad)closer to 100 kpa, so that sounds somewhat normal..I would go through ALL of you settings in Megatune to be sure nothing got skewed when you did the firmware change. Sometimes a few settings can get off when upgrading. Especially check the closed loop perameters, as you your o2 settings may have changed, and the ECU is trying to run super lean. Verify you have all the settings the way they should be, then go from there.

I did a couple more datalogs with the same firmware. BTW I was running 029q2 and updated to 029t. From the new datalogs I noticed that the map signal starts to shoot up for no reason and that is what causes the car to shut down.

OK so I fire it up and it warms up fine and idles perfectly stoich for about 3 mins after it reaches OT and then dies. What really gets me is after the car dies I can't start it for about 3 mins...if I try right after it stalls the MS doesn't light up at all so no tach signal or anything. So after I get it started up again the car starts to run really lean and runs for about 2 mins and dies. Again I can't start it up for 3 mins. Again fire it up and now its running really rich and dies after 2 mins of running. Those are the 3 conditions I logged last night. My next step is to convert back to the 029q2.

I mean the only reason I updated it was due to the warmup fix the 029t fixed.

I can post the datalogs I have if you would like.

So any other suggestions due to last nights findings?

--------------------

- 05 Subaru STi
- 97 eclipse gs (289whp w/ 276tq)

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WickedESi	Jan-09-07 05:33 AM
Donating 2GNT member 3090 posts,

#2873, "RE: Car Stalling Out"
In response to Reply # 12

Is your car shutting off exactly when the fan is suppose to kick on?

Joel Baldridge, ASE Certified Master Technician, Audi Certified Expert Technician

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wite96gs	Jan-09-07 01:25 PM
Member since Mar 20th 2004 365 posts,

#2874, "RE: Car Stalling Out"
In response to Reply # 13

The fan control indicator just flickers on the MT screen. It has always been that way, why, what are you thinking?

-----------
the first solution that comes to mind for any new problem with my car usually involves a can of bad gas and a match...

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Aggression	Jan-10-07 02:05 AM
Old School 2GNTer 3025 posts,

#2875, "RE: Car Stalling Out"
In response to Reply # 14

OK...well I went back to the 029q2 and everything works fine again, except the warmup which is the reason I updated in the first place.

The only thing that blows my mind is why I couldn't restart the car right after it stalled out. I wonder if I just had a bad flash into 29t or if that version has a problem with the neon decoder!

--------------------

- 05 Subaru STi
- 97 eclipse gs (289whp w/ 276tq)

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wite96gs	Jan-10-07 05:21 AM
Member since Mar 20th 2004 365 posts,

#2876, "RE: Car Stalling Out"
In response to Reply # 15

That's exactly what I was thinking. Is anyone else running 29t on here?

-----------
the first solution that comes to mind for any new problem with my car usually involves a can of bad gas and a match...

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customrsturbo	Jan-10-07 03:35 PM
Member since Oct 06th 2003 249 posts,

#2878, "RE: Car Stalling Out"
In response to Reply # 16

I'm running the 029t version. I had a similar problem with the fan option. If I connect the Rad fan to the relay, I would not have connection to the MS.
With the cable disconnected I have no problems conecting to the MS. It also flickers when I turn the car on. So far I have a switch on the fan. I will get an extarnal thermostat for the rad fan until the problem with the fan control is fixed.
Try this, after you car dies, disconnect the rad fan cable from the relay and try to turn ON the car. See if you can start it.

1995 Eclipse RS-T
GT35R, SPEC Stage 5 clutch
E85 Fuel(Helping the Ecosystem)
MS, v3.0, 029t
10.87 @ 135

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Aggression	Jan-11-07 02:40 AM
Old School 2GNTer 3025 posts,

#2879, "RE: Car Stalling Out"
In response to Reply # 17

Originally posted by customrsturbo
I'm running the 029t version. I had a similar problem with the fan option. If I connect the Rad fan to the relay, I would not have connection to the MS. With the cable disconnected I have no problems conecting to the MS. It also flickers when I turn the car on. So far I have a switch on the fan. I will get an extarnal thermostat for the rad fan until the problem with the fan control is fixed. Try this, after you car dies, disconnect the rad fan cable from the relay and try to turn ON the car. See if you can start it.

I'll have to take a look at that. Thanks!

--------------------

- 05 Subaru STi
- 97 eclipse gs (289whp w/ 276tq)

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wite96gs	Jan-12-07 07:38 AM
Member since Mar 20th 2004 365 posts,

#2881, "RE: Car Stalling Out"
In response to Reply # 17

Originally posted by customrsturbo
I'm running the 029t version. I had a similar problem with the fan option. If I connect the Rad fan to the relay, I would not have connection to the MS. With the cable disconnected I have no problems conecting to the MS. It also flickers when I turn the car on. So far I have a switch on the fan. I will get an extarnal thermostat for the rad fan until the problem with the fan control is fixed. Try this, after you car dies, disconnect the rad fan cable from the relay and try to turn ON the car. See if you can start it.

The cooling fans are being control by the stock ECU still. We have both fans connected in parallel.
We noticed that when the fans kick on there is a momentary stumble in the idle of the motor. I'm wondering if the start-up current draw of the fans could be causing the issue of the MS locking up. Like an instantaneous low voltage condition that is causing the MS to freak out and stop running.
-----------
'96 Eclipse GS
'94 Talon TSi AWD 6 bolt

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customrsturbo	Jan-12-07 09:51 AM
Member since Oct 06th 2003 249 posts,

#2924, "RE: Car Stalling Out"
In response to Reply # 19

Originally posted by wite96gs

Originally posted by customrsturbo I'm running the 029t version. I had a similar problem with the fan option. If I connect the Rad fan to the relay, I would not have connection to the MS. With the cable disconnected I have no problems conecting to the MS. It also flickers when I turn the car on. So far I have a switch on the fan. I will get an extarnal thermostat for the rad fan until the problem with the fan control is fixed. Try this, after you car dies, disconnect the rad fan cable from the relay and try to turn ON the car. See if you can start it.

The cooling fans are being control by the stock ECU still. We have both fans connected in parallel. We noticed that when the fans kick on there is a momentary stumble in the idle of the motor. I'm wondering if the start-up current draw of the fans could be causing the issue of the MS locking up. Like an instantaneous low voltage condition that is causing the MS to freak out and stop running. ----------- '96 Eclipse GS '94 Talon TSi AWD 6 bolt

If the car is ON, I can connect the fan cable to the relay and the fan stays ON. If I turn OFF the car and try to restart the car, the comunication to the MS is gone. If I disconect the fan cable from the relay, the comunications resumes.

1995 Eclipse RS-T
GT35R, SPEC Stage 5 clutch
E85 Fuel(Helping the Ecosystem)
MS, v3.0, 029t
10.87 @ 135

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Aggression	Jan-15-07 02:22 AM
Old School 2GNTer 3025 posts,

#2925, "RE: Car Stalling Out"
In response to Reply # 20

Originally posted by customrsturbo
If the car is ON, I can connect the fan cable to the relay and the fan stays ON. If I turn OFF the car and try to restart the car, the comunication to the MS is gone. If I disconect the fan cable from the relay, the comunications resumes.

See that makes no sense, but at the same time it does with the 029t firmware. Have you tried or thought about going to the 029v and seeing if that acts any differently?

--------------------

- 05 Subaru STi
- 97 eclipse gs (289whp w/ 276tq)

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wite96gs	Jan-15-07 05:36 AM
Member since Mar 20th 2004 365 posts,

#2926, "RE: Car Stalling Out"
In response to Reply # 21

I'd like to try the 029v firmware, just to see what happens.
-----------
'96 Eclipse GS
'94 Talon TSi AWD 6 bolt

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customrsturbo	Jan-15-07 08:49 AM
Member since Oct 06th 2003 249 posts,

#2927, "RE: Car Stalling Out"
In response to Reply # 21

Originally posted by Aggression

Originally posted by customrsturbo If the car is ON, I can connect the fan cable to the relay and the fan stays ON. If I turn OFF the car and try to restart the car, the comunication to the MS is gone. If I disconect the fan cable from the relay, the comunications resumes.

See that makes no sense, but at the same time it does with the 029t firmware. Have you tried or thought about going to the 029v and seeing if that acts any differently?

No, it doesn't bother me that much. I will provide a external thermostat for fan control.

1995 Eclipse RS-T
GT35R, SPEC Stage 5 clutch
E85 Fuel(Helping the Ecosystem)
MS, v3.0, 029t
10.87 @ 135

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Aggression	Jan-16-07 01:46 AM
Old School 2GNTer 3025 posts,

#2928, "RE: Car Stalling Out"
In response to Reply # 23

Originally posted by customrsturbo

Originally posted by Aggression

Originally posted by customrsturbo If the car is ON, I can connect the fan cable to the relay and the fan stays ON. If I turn OFF the car and try to restart the car, the comunication to the MS is gone. If I disconect the fan cable from the relay, the comunications resumes.

See that makes no sense, but at the same time it does with the 029t firmware. Have you tried or thought about going to the 029v and seeing if that acts any differently?

No, it doesn't bother me that much. I will provide a external thermostat for fan control.

I can understand that but I've heard people saying they get smoother accel with v as well. Its worth a try don't you think?

--------------------

- 05 Subaru STi
- 97 eclipse gs (289whp w/ 276tq)

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customrsturbo	Jan-16-07 03:39 AM
Member since Oct 06th 2003 249 posts,

#2930, "RE: Car Stalling Out"
In response to Reply # 24

Originally posted by Aggression

Originally posted by customrsturbo

Originally posted by Aggression

Originally posted by customrsturbo If the car is ON, I can connect the fan cable to the relay and the fan stays ON. If I turn OFF the car and try to restart the car, the comunication to the MS is gone. If I disconect the fan cable from the relay, the comunications resumes.

See that makes no sense, but at the same time it does with the 029t firmware. Have you tried or thought about going to the 029v and seeing if that acts any differently?

No, it doesn't bother me that much. I will provide a external thermostat for fan control.

I can understand that but I've heard people saying they get smoother accel with v as well. Its worth a try don't you think?

Yes, I think I might us it. I'm having some bugs while cruising and each time a drop of voltage occours.

1995 Eclipse RS-T
GT35R, SPEC Stage 5 clutch
E85 Fuel(Helping the Ecosystem)
MS, v3.0, 029t
10.87 @ 135

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wite96gs	Jan-16-07 05:20 AM
Member since Mar 20th 2004 365 posts,

#2933, "RE: Car Stalling Out"
In response to Reply # 25

Maybe the addition of a big cap on the power supply input could help with that.

-----------
'96 Eclipse GS
'94 Talon TSi AWD 6 bolt

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customrsturbo	Jan-16-07 06:58 AM
Member since Oct 06th 2003 249 posts,

#2936, "RE: Car Stalling Out"
In response to Reply # 26

Originally posted by wite96gs
Maybe the addition of a big cap on the power supply input could help with that. ----------- '96 Eclipse GS '94 Talon TSi AWD 6 bolt

Yes, I need to do that. Time is the matter. Thanks.

1995 Eclipse RS-T
GT35R, SPEC Stage 5 clutch
E85 Fuel(Helping the Ecosystem)
MS, v3.0, 029t
10.87 @ 135

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Performance/Engine

Engine Management Systems & Controllers

topic #2820

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