#86737, "max on stock engine - 7-8psi or 250-300hp?"
alright, I remember way back when like a year ago when I was new here everybody said that we couldn't make much more then 300hp (it might have been 250hp) on the stock motor. now everybody says 7-8psi. which is the maximum limit? what if somebody has a smaller turbo that doesn't flow as much as the Super 16G and makes less power for every pound of boost? would they still be limited to 8psi? I'm not sure if I've got my theory right but making 300hp on 8psi and 300hp on 12psi should be the exact same thing, as far as the pistons and rods are concerned. We are talking about the same amount of air and fuel in either case, aren't we? so why should the stock motor be limited to 8psi? feel free to school me, I am kind of lost here
#86740, "RE: max on stock engine - 7-8psi or 250-300hp?" In response to Reply # 0
Both. Neither. Who knows? You are picking generalizations out of posts that have no real world bearing on what a "stock" motor can take. Real world situations differ. combustion chamber pressure, load, heat, age, metal fatigue, plus a million different things can affect how much HP or Boost an engine can take. Go find a junker in a junkyard and boost it till it blows up. Do it again on another one, and I guarantee you the results will be different. Call up the techies at Chrysler and have them put a new 420a in their engine testing room and have them tune it to perfection and the results will be different. get it?
There is no magic number here.
except for 42.
......................................................................................................................... Built. That's All... ......................................................................................................................... www.monkeybuttpirate.com ......................................................................................................................... 2 Fingers of Scotch with a milk back... Stat!
#86744, "RE: max on stock engine - 7-8psi or 250-300hp?" In response to Reply # 2
The easy answer is that you're going to blow your engine eventually running anything over 5psi on any turbo, so it really doesn't matter. Just get the money for a rebuild ready, and boost all you want.
#86745, "RE: max on stock engine - 7-8psi or 250-300hp?" In response to Reply # 3
Really? I know a lot of people running 8 psi daily on stock internals with no problems. Isn't that the recommended boost level for Hahn's Stage 2 kit anyway?
I plan on running 8 psi if I ever get my turbo kit done. (14b, 1G SMIC)
. . . Oh no! My sig died! I'll get another one. Member and Co-Founder of FLDSM
#86746, "RE: max on stock engine - 7-8psi or 250-300hp?" In response to Reply # 4 Jun-09-05 07:23 AM by BumpinTalon
Originally posted by BRU_ce Really? I know a lot of people running 8 psi daily on stock internals with no problems. Isn't that the recommended boost level for Hahn's Stage 2 kit anyway? I plan on running 8 psi if I ever get my turbo kit done. (14b, 1G SMIC)
I want to make it into the 200s for whp on the stock bottom end. with a fancy computer that'll let me tune my setup to the absolute bleeding edge, I think I can get it done. I'm going to push the envelope and run 9psi, pistons be damned
#86749, "RE: max on stock engine - 7-8psi or 250-300hp?" In response to Reply # 5
Originally posted by BumpinTalon
Originally posted by BRU_ce Really? I know a lot of people running 8 psi daily on stock internals with no problems. Isn't that the recommended boost level for Hahn's Stage 2 kit anyway? I plan on running 8 psi if I ever get my turbo kit done. (14b, 1G SMIC)
I want to make it into the 200s for whp on the stock bottom end. with a fancy computer that'll let me tune my setup to the absolute bleeding edge, I think I can get it done. I'm going to push the envelope and run 9psi, pistons be damned
I think you should be able to reach your goal.
. . . Oh no! My sig died! I'll get another one. Member and Co-Founder of FLDSM
#86787, "RE: max on stock engine - 7-8psi or 250-300hp?" In response to Reply # 5
Originally posted by BumpinTalon
Originally posted by BRU_ce Really? I know a lot of people running 8 psi daily on stock internals with no problems. Isn't that the recommended boost level for Hahn's Stage 2 kit anyway? I plan on running 8 psi if I ever get my turbo kit done. (14b, 1G SMIC)
I want to make it into the 200s for whp on the stock bottom end. with a fancy computer that'll let me tune my setup to the absolute bleeding edge, I think I can get it done. I'm going to push the envelope and run 9psi, pistons be damned
If you tune to the bleeding edge it will blow. Probably rather quickly. Any change can throw your bleeding edge tune into a rather dangerous mixture ... and it only takes 1 instance and it's over. Even on a built motor ... if a catastrophic event occurs when your on that edge it's going to do damage.
#86800, "RE: max on stock engine - 7-8psi or 250-300hp?" In response to Reply # 9
Originally posted by Avenger
Originally posted by BumpinTalon
Originally posted by BRU_ce Really? I know a lot of people running 8 psi daily on stock internals with no problems. Isn't that the recommended boost level for Hahn's Stage 2 kit anyway? I plan on running 8 psi if I ever get my turbo kit done. (14b, 1G SMIC)
I want to make it into the 200s for whp on the stock bottom end. with a fancy computer that'll let me tune my setup to the absolute bleeding edge, I think I can get it done. I'm going to push the envelope and run 9psi, pistons be damned
If you tune to the bleeding edge it will blow. Probably rather quickly. Any change can throw your bleeding edge tune into a rather dangerous mixture ... and it only takes 1 instance and it's over. Even on a built motor ... if a catastrophic event occurs when your on that edge it's going to do damage.
well that's a bummer I'm not stopping until I get over 200whp on the stock bottom end... it is definitely possible, there is one guy who got 200whp with a huuuge turbo on the stock bottom end boosting only 5psi I thin. then I'll wait a year, rebuild my engine, and work on 350whp.
#86777, "RE: max on stock engine - 7-8psi or 250-300hp?" In response to Reply # 4 Jun-10-05 12:48 PM by thedawg
Originally posted by BRU_ce Really? I know a lot of people running 8 psi daily on stock internals with no problems. Isn't that the recommended boost level for Hahn's Stage 2 kit anyway?
8psi assumes everything is running right. All the components in our cars have tolerances, say +-10%. If a certain number of these components fail or vary enough, like say, the HRC FPR, you will blow your engine.
All cars come from the factory with these tolerances in mind. They design all components to survive the worst case failure mode of all the components. Turbo kits and all electronic mods in general take advantage of this "extra strength" built into the engine by pulling 100% of the possible performance out of the engine, instead of the 80% maximum it was designed for. Once you're consistently using that extra 20%, you effectively have NO protection for the time WHEN those unexpected failures happen.
I've personally run 12psi with a modified HRC kit (+SFMU, Wideband, Datalogger, SAFC, 440cc, MissingLink) and I consider it safe on stock internals.
I've also personally blown my engine at 6psi, with the HRC kit directly out of the box, configured exactly to spec.
It's simply not a question of "IF" xyz boost is safe, just a matter of "WHEN" your engine will blow. People have a hard time with this, but its fact as far as I'm concerned.
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