Hey Guys,

friend of mine is hooking me up w/ 1g dsm fuel rail (with 1:1 fpr), stock 450cc injectors, and injector harness...

so my question is, can the 034 eic control low imp. injectors like the dsm injectors?

also, is the dsm stock 1:1 fpr "good enough" for this type of setup? and if not, could i use one of the fprs for the 4g63 on the end of this rail instead of the aeromotive unit?

Im only payying $10 for everything is why i ask

thanks-

95 Avenger
ATX->MTX Swap
Holset HX40 @ 26 psi

ryan, thats the same setup im using. check out gregs post on 1:1 fprs for reasons not to use the stock dsm fpr. everything else is good tho, cant answer your ? about the eic controlling the low imp. injectors tho. i thought it could too...
also check out metaljim's post, i think its titled "would you trust jb weld with this" or something, good info there too.

Dan
97 Base Dodge Avenger
aem cai, jeep tb, 17" gsx rims, tq mod, eclipse center console, shift knob, autometer phantom trans temp & a/f gauge

boosted by summer

Yeah Ryan. I answered this on the JB weld thread..but yeah you'll be fine with those injectors. No resistors needed.


95 Eclipse RS : 5 speed
Jeep TB writeup - http://www.dimensia.com:81/jimbo/JeepTBfor2gnt.html

excellent

so how about the fpr situation, can i use one of the 1:1 fprs designed for the dsm rail, like the command flow, instead of the aeromotive?

95 Avenger
ATX->MTX Swap
Holset HX40 @ 26 psi

I don't know how long it will take Corbin to see this but I asked the same thing and he said NOT to use a stock reg like that. I forget why but I took his word for it.

One of the biggest reasons that you don't want to use stock peices are that they are not adjustable. I have found the adjustability of the Aeromotive to be very useful in smoothing out the transition from 4 injector duty to 8 (right above 0 psig). And the Aeromotive was designed to handle alot of fuel. The stock FPR might get "over-run" if you use a big fuel pump (or 2 pumps in series). I was un-employed and near broke while I was building that setup. I considered alot of short cuts to save money, but knew that I wouldn't be happy unless I did it "right".

Corbin

'95 ESI-T
HRC+FMIC+ETC...



Gimme fuel...Gimme fire...Gimme that which I desire

I've heard the same thing about the stock FPR and high pressure pumps, or higher flowing fuel lines/filters. Check out this link - in the section "A word about fuel pressure regulators" : http://www.stevetek.com/R-FuelSys2G.html


95 Eclipse RS : 5 speed
Jeep TB writeup - http://www.dimensia.com:81/jimbo/JeepTBfor2gnt.html

>Yeah Ryan. I answered this on the JB weld thread..but yeah
>you'll be fine with those injectors. No resistors needed.
>





hmmm...

i just got this reply back from Javad (my original email is on the bottom):
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _


The unit will not run low impedance injectors unless you use a resistor pack in front of each one, which you can probably find at a wrecking yard. Overall you will notice the best performance from the high imp. injectors, your choice though.

Keep me posted on your project and if you'd like to become a featured user.

Thanks,
Javad

>Hi,
>
>I just recently purchased a 034 extra injector controller through a group buy on the 2gnt.com forums. I had originally planned on running ford high-impedence secondary injectors, which i know the 034 can control from what others are doing. However i just recently acquired a set of DSM low-imp. injectors, but just wondering if the 034 eic can control low-imp. injectors? Are they plug and play just like high-imp injectors, or do i need to run some sort of resistors or anything?
>
>Thanks for the help, looking foward to running the 034 eic very soon,
>Ryan M
>avengr1995@aol.com
>




so...now im confused again, lol

95 Avenger
ATX->MTX Swap
Holset HX40 @ 26 psi

It may help to understand impedance and resistance are the same thing.

So... if you have a low-impedance injector and add (impedance/resistance/resistors) you suddenly have a high impedance injector. There are obvious disadvantages to Jerry-rigging it like this, as well as not so obvious ones- like resistance fluctuation caused by temperature changes.

Here's a Honda howto page, it's the same process for us:
http://www.hondata.com/techinjectorwiring.html

right, i understand that.

what im saying is metal jim was saying in that other thread that no resisotrs are needed to run the dsm injectors w/ the 034 eic, but the 034 guy said resistors are needed... confused b/c Jim said Javad told him the opposite, heh

95 Avenger
ATX->MTX Swap
Holset HX40 @ 26 psi

<bump>

95 Avenger
ATX->MTX Swap
Holset HX40 @ 26 psi

Here's the way I understand it from how he explained it to me:

There's 2 drivers. The actual number of injectors that each driver supports depends on the impedance. You can run
ONE 1.0-1.4 ohm injector
TWO 2.0-4.0 ohm injectors
or FIVE 12.0-14.0 ohm injectors
...per driver

So for exampe, the injectors that I want to run all measured in between 2.7-2.9 ohms. I was under the impression that I could run 2 of these injectors per driver, just like in Corbin's writeup.

I don't think I misunderstood what he told me. I DID misrepresent what KIND of injectors I planned on using. I didn't know at the time what the ohm measurement was on my injectors, I thought they were high impedance and even claimed ignorance to knowing the difference between high and low impedance - and so thats how I asked him in my email. I'm still not sure if they're high or low or even medium impedance - all I know is that they all measured between 2.7-2.9 ohms. Is that low impedance? Even if it is, from what he told me, the 034 should be able to handle 2 of them on one of the drivers - or 4 on 2 drivers.

Ryan, I think I know what the problem is. In your email to him, you mentioned "low impedance" injectors. Well, that seems to be a somewhat subjective description. Maybe he though that your "low impedance" injectors are the 1.0-1.4 ohm variety and not the 2.0-4.0 ohm variety. It sounds like there are 3 varietys of injectors as far as the 034 is concerned:
low impedance - 1.0-1.4 ohms - 1 injector per driver
low(medium?) impedance - 2.0-4.0 ohms - 2 injectors per driver
high impedance - 12.0-14.0 ohms - 5 injectors per driver

The ONLY reason I know to call the 12.0-14.0 ohm injectors "high impedance" is because that's what Javad called them in his email. I'm still confused as to what to call the lower ranges. Mabe it is just a miscommunication regarding "low impedance" and "low(medium) impedance" injectors?

What's the resistance on your injectors - between 2.0-4.0 ohms? You should be fine with 2 injectors per driver. If they measure between 1.0-1.4, then you'll need the resistors.

Here's my email from him:

-----------------------------------
With regard to your injector question, basicall you can run up to 5 high impedance (12-14ohms) injectors per driver, the only 1 - 1.0-1.4ohm and 2 - 2-4ohm.

Sounds like you want to run 2-high imp. off each driver, you won't have any problems there.

HTH,
Javad
034efi.com

>Hello.
>
>I recently purchased a Supplimentary Injector ECU. I plan to using it to
>install a rail of 390cc injectors from a turbo-eclipse into my non-turbo
>Eclipse(which will soon be turbo). These turbo-eclipse injectors are high
>impedance. Do I have to install a resistor inline to make them low
>impedence? I really don't want to fry the Injector ECU, and I don't really
>understand what the injector impedence specification(1.0-1.4, 2.0-4.0, 12+
>ohms) on your web-site means. I know that if I were to use the high
>impedence injectors on my stock ECU without installing a resistor to make
>them low impedence - that the stock ECU would not be happy at all. Any help
>you could give me would be appreciated.
>
-----------------------------------


95 Eclipse RS : 5 speed
Jeep TB writeup - http://www.dimensia.com:81/jimbo/JeepTBfor2gnt.html

Hmmm, that could be...

Im going to send him another message w/ a link to this thread, maybe Javad can clear things up better that way.

Thanks-

95 Avenger
ATX->MTX Swap
Holset HX40 @ 26 psi

Thats a great idea. Hi Javad.


95 Eclipse RS : 5 speed
Jeep TB writeup - http://www.dimensia.com:81/jimbo/JeepTBfor2gnt.html

Just got Jivad's reply back:

"Realistically, for best performance and product longevity, only High impedance injectors should be run with the 034EFI SIC. The unit will run one low impedance injector per driver, but driver performance and longevity may be compromised. Resistor packs should be used with low imp. injectors, doing so up to 4 low imp. injectors with resistor packs can be run off the unit.

Hope that clears things up, I definitely recommend High Imp. overall.

Thanks,
Javad
034efi"





So...basically sounds like he recommends sticking to high impedance injectors, but low imp. injectors w/ resistors will work.

95 Avenger
ATX->MTX Swap
Holset HX40 @ 26 psi

Cool. Thanks Javad.

The timing of this post is impecable. I had sent my 390s to be cleaned/balanced. He called a couple of days ago and tells me that 2 were unsalvageable and he didn't have any remanufactured ones availiable...but the guy said he'd keep a lookout for some. This is where the timing coms in - he just called me with a set for $200 shipped. Whew! That was close. I'd rather not use resistors.

Anyway, I started talking to him about this situation I'm in, because I've got other concerns besides the impedance. The rail outlets for the turbo model are smaller than the non-turbo(or Accel, RC eng, etc) AND the pintle seals are bigger. I already got the injector bosses from Corbin, and I don't want to use wider ones. I WAS looking into just getting some Viton o-rings to try and make it all fit....BUT he says that he can hook me up with some high-imps that'll fit properly. We'll see what happens. Looks like I have an injector guy.

Thanks alot for posting about this Ryan.
I finally understand what impedance is.


95 Eclipse RS : 5 speed
Jeep TB writeup - http://www.dimensia.com:81/jimbo/JeepTBfor2gnt.html

No problem, i also needed to know, heh. Good thing i got those dsm injectors free, so I wont be out any cash. Ill be sticking to my original plan now and using my current 315 ford injectors as the secondaries w/ 270cc primaries.

95 Avenger
ATX->MTX Swap
Holset HX40 @ 26 psi

Isnt there a functional difference between peak&hold vs. saturated injectors?

I thought 4g63 injectors were not just the wrong impedance for our cars, but also the wrong type as well.