2GNT.com Forums - Viewing topic - Head coming off...what else should I do

Home Site Background Info & Specs Mods & Tech Info CAPS Part Reviews Donate 2GNT Stickers

Printer-friendly copy

0 Users in Chat

4G63 Tech

topic #8359

View in linear mode

Subject: "Head coming off...what else should I do"

Previous topic | Next topic

FlyinEsi	Apr-21-09 09:18 AM
Donating 2GNT member 5187 posts,

#8359, "Head coming off...what else should I do"
Jun-06-05 09:46 AM by FlyinEsi

I should have my new headgasket and radiator here today or tomorrow. I talked to my dad (mechanic of 30 years) and he told me I might as well change out my timing belt (62K on the clock) and water pump. Okay, I can take care of that, and he also told me I should have my head checked for cracks and to make sure the whole valve train is all in good working condition, especially to make sure the valves are "seated"??? He says if I've been running lean I could have some problems there.

While I have the head off getting decked, is there anything else I might as well do to it now? I was thinking about getting like a 3 angle valve job, port and polish, along with the usual racing equipment in the head (new springs, retainers?) etc.

Anything I really SHOULD do to the head while it is off and at a qualified shop?

Hopefully I will have the car taken apart this weekend, or early next week, and fixed in the next couple weeks.

___________________________________

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

Replies to this topic

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, Team

Team

Jeff_99gs, Jun-06-05 10:01 AM, #1

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, FlyinEsi, Jun-06-05 10:03 AM, #2

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, 420a-Tnthewerks, Jun-06-05 10:02 AM, #3

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, FlyinEsi, Jun-06-05 10:07 AM, #4

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, slowmitsu, Jun-06-05 11:10 AM, #5

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, BigBald, Jun-06-05 11:15 AM, #6

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, FlyinEsi, Jun-06-05 12:19 PM, #7

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, Team

Team

Jeff_99gs, Jun-06-05 06:22 PM, #8

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, FlyinEsi, Jun-07-05 04:08 AM, #9

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, BigBald, Jun-07-05 05:34 AM, #10

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, HybriDSM, Jun-07-05 07:21 AM, #11

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, Team

Team

Jeff_99gs, Jun-07-05 08:03 AM, #12

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, BMPDirk, Jun-07-05 08:10 AM, #13

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, BigBald, Jun-07-05 08:19 AM, #14

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, Team

Team

Jeff_99gs, Jun-07-05 09:00 AM, #15

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, Team

Team

Jeff_99gs, Jun-07-05 08:33 AM, #16

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, BigBald, Jun-07-05 08:39 AM, #17

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, Team

Team

Jeff_99gs, Jun-07-05 08:45 AM, #18

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, BigBald, Jun-07-05 09:01 AM, #19

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, Team

Team

Jeff_99gs, Jun-07-05 09:03 AM, #20

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, HybriDSM, Jun-07-05 09:08 AM, #21

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, BigBald, Jun-07-05 09:54 AM, #22

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, HybriDSM, Jun-07-05 10:23 AM, #23

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, BigBald, Jun-07-05 10:58 AM, #24

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, Moderator

Moderator

eclipzGST, Jun-07-05 01:11 PM, #25

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, BigBald, Jun-07-05 02:04 PM, #26

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, PowerEclipses, Jun-07-05 04:45 PM, #27

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, HybriDSM, Jun-07-05 05:37 PM, #28

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, FlyinEsi, Jun-08-05 09:46 AM, #29

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, HybriDSM, Jun-08-05 10:09 AM, #30

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, FlyinEsi, Jun-08-05 10:35 AM, #31

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, HybriDSM, Jun-08-05 11:44 AM, #32

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, FlyinEsi, Jun-08-05 01:15 PM, #33

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, HybriDSM, Jun-08-05 01:23 PM, #34

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, FlyinEsi, Jun-08-05 01:30 PM, #35

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, Hult250R, Jun-08-05 02:06 PM, #36

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, HybriDSM, Jun-08-05 04:38 PM, #37

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, Hult250R, Jun-08-05 04:59 PM, #38

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, Moderator

Moderator

eclipzGST, Jun-08-05 09:25 PM, #39

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, BigBald, Jun-09-05 04:25 AM, #40

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, FlyinEsi, Jun-09-05 04:29 AM, #41

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, slowmitsu, Jun-09-05 05:02 AM, #42

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, BigBald, Jun-09-05 08:11 AM, #43

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, FlyinEsi, Jun-09-05 12:11 PM, #44

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, HybriDSM, Jun-09-05 01:47 PM, #45

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, FlyinEsi, Jun-10-05 04:24 AM, #46

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, slowmitsu, Jun-10-05 04:45 AM, #47

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, BigBald, Jun-10-05 05:20 AM, #48

RE: Head coming off...what else should I do, PowerEclipses, Jun-11-05 05:10 PM, #49

Jeff_99gs	Jun-06-05 10:01 AM
Donating 2GNT member 5473 posts,

#8360, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 0

The head will be fine. Just make sure there is no warping from the overheating.

If you want a built head now, go for it. Titanium retainers, springs, cams, etc. It really isn't worth it though at this point and will cost a lot more money. You can do whatever you want though if you want to spend the cash.

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

FlyinEsi	Jun-06-05 10:03 AM
Donating 2GNT member 5187 posts,

#8361, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 1

Originally posted by Jeff_99gs
The head will be fine. Just make sure there is no warping from the overheating. If you want a built head now, go for it. Titanium retainers, springs, cams, etc. It really isn't worth it though at this point and will cost a lot more money. You can do whatever you want though if you want to spend the cash.

What about just doing a port and polish on the head while it is there? Is that worth it, or does our head flow enough air as is?

___________________________________

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

420a-Tnthewerks	Jun-06-05 10:02 AM
Member since Jun 11th 2004 2267 posts,

#8362, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 0

I would at least get a 3 or 5 angle valve job while it's there. The rest, well, depends on your budget.

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

FlyinEsi	Jun-06-05 10:07 AM
Donating 2GNT member 5187 posts,

#8363, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 3

Okay, I do not ever plan on running 9K RPMS on my head, so would titanium springs and retainers even be worth it whatsoever? or stock should cut it?

Angled valve job? Really what is this? Does it just help increase airflow?

My budget I am somewhat putting aside, I just want the car to run right, and if I can get a little performance out at the same time, I might as well.

I was also thinking about picking up a set of FP272 cams later this summer, but I might just do it now. Adv/Dis of the 272 cams????

All advice and knowledge sharing is greatly appreciated. Help me learn more about my car!!!!!! PLEASE!!!!

___________________________________

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

slowmitsu	Jun-06-05 11:10 AM
Member since May 26th 2005 343 posts,

#8364, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 4
Jun-06-05 11:12 AM by slowmitsu

Originally posted by FlyinEsi
Okay, I do not ever plan on running 9K RPMS on my head, so would titanium springs and retainers even be worth it whatsoever? or stock should cut it? Angled valve job? Really what is this? Does it just help increase airflow? My budget I am somewhat putting aside, I just want the car to run right, and if I can get a little performance out at the same time, I might as well. I was also thinking about picking up a set of FP272 cams later this summer, but I might just do it now. Adv/Dis of the 272 cams???? All advice and knowledge sharing is greatly appreciated. Help me learn more about my car!!!!!! PLEASE!!!!

A bunch of no's. Unless you're willing to dump a few large into getting the head built then there really isn't a huge point in only doing a few little things here and there to it. Cams will help though but that's not rocket science since you can have the head on the car while changing them obviously. I've seen you post about down time concerns and getting your head built will only add to that. You've got plenty of other places to spend money before you start ripping the head apart..(i.e. your bottom end, better fuel setup, bigger turbo, etc).

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

BigBald	Jun-06-05 11:15 AM
Member since Oct 22nd 2002 2715 posts,

#8365, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 5

Port and polish is a waste of time on any turbo that flows less then 60lbs/min. For you, I would get either a set of cams and/or a sheet metal intake manifold. You will see great improvements performance mods from either of those mods. You don't need springs, retainers or valves unless something is wrong with yours or you plan on shifting past 8k.

_____________________________________________
Jerrome B.
1995 GSX - Race
1997 GST - Drive
1995 GST - Who the hell knows

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

FlyinEsi	Jun-06-05 12:19 PM
Donating 2GNT member 5187 posts,

#8366, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 6

Originally posted by BigBald
Port and polish is a waste of time on any turbo that flows less then 60lbs/min. For you, I would get either a set of cams and/or a sheet metal intake manifold. You will see great improvements performance mods from either of those mods. You don't need springs, retainers or valves unless something is wrong with yours or you plan on shifting past 8k.

Cool, thanks Jerrome.

___________________________________

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

Jeff_99gs	Jun-06-05 06:22 PM
Donating 2GNT member 5473 posts,

#8367, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 7

And cams are worthless without shifting pass 7k as well. Just stick with the stock head.

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

FlyinEsi	Jun-07-05 04:08 AM
Donating 2GNT member 5187 posts,

#8368, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 8

Originally posted by Jeff_99gs
And cams are worthless without shifting pass 7k as well. Just stick with the stock head.

Done, done, done, done and done. Stock head it is. Just going to have him look through it to make sure it all looks okay, then deck it.

Thanks guys, I really appreciate your help!

___________________________________

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

BigBald	Jun-07-05 05:34 AM
Member since Oct 22nd 2002 2715 posts,

#8369, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 8
Jun-07-05 05:47 AM by BigBald

Originally posted by Jeff_99gs
And cams are worthless without shifting pass 7k as well. Just stick with the stock head.

There are logs and Dynos that prove severely otherwise......are you serious? I can see a sheet metal arguement but def not cams.

Edit: This is how worthless Cams are

Stock vs 272's Dyno
http://www.automotosports.com/Stock%20VS%20HKS%20272%20272.JP G

Stock vs 264's Dyno
http://www.automotosports.com/Stock%20VS%20HKS%20264%20264.JP G

The Whole Test:
http://www.automotosports.com/cam_test.asp

_____________________________________________
Jerrome B.
1995 GSX - Race
1997 GST - Drive
1995 GST - Who the hell knows

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

HybriDSM	Jun-07-05 07:21 AM
Member since Aug 07th 2002 2407 posts,

#8370, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 10
Jun-07-05 07:23 AM by HybriDSM

Originally posted by BigBald

Originally posted by Jeff_99gs And cams are worthless without shifting pass 7k as well. Just stick with the stock head.

There are logs and Dynos that prove severely otherwise......are you serious? I can see a sheet metal arguement but def not cams. Edit: This is how worthless Cams are Stock vs 272's Dyno http://www.automotosports.com/Stock%20VS%20HKS%20272%20272.JP G Stock vs 264's Dyno http://www.automotosports.com/Stock%20VS%20HKS%20264%20264.JP G The Whole Test: http://www.automotosports.com/cam_test.asp

Interesting graphs.

Looks like a well done test they did. I wish more places did that kind of research for the various parts.

It's running again shitheads.

http://www.dsmregistry.com/detail.php?carid=791

HybriDSM@gmail.com ; HybriDSM@hotmail.com

Think for yourself. Question authority does not always mean disagree with authority.

If life were perfect, I'd be Calvin and you'd be Hobbes.

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

Jeff_99gs	Jun-07-05 08:03 AM
Donating 2GNT member 5473 posts,

#8371, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 11

There are far too many variables there for that graph to actually mean anything.

Sound familiar?

Of course cams will make more power, but without a head that can rev higher than 7,000 I don't think they are really necessary. If $600 is worth 16hp and 28 torque, go for it. But then again, there are far too many variables in there for that graph to actually meany anything at all. Right?

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

BMPDirk	Jun-07-05 08:10 AM
Member since Jul 24th 2002 1288 posts,

#8372, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 12
Jun-07-05 08:27 AM by BMPDirk

EDIT: nevermind

______________________________________________________
2003.5 M3
99 M3
99 GST

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

BigBald	Jun-07-05 08:19 AM
Member since Oct 22nd 2002 2715 posts,

#8373, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 13

oh man...here we go again.....

1. You pay about the same for an exhaust and receive the same amount of gains. The thing about the exhaust is, that is it with that purcahse. With cams, you results will vary from turbo to turbo and mods of course.

2. Everythning in that test remain constant Jeff....does that sound familiar? Nothing changed but the drop in of the cams. So with that said, what can be a variable in this particular test to make any of the data provided invalid? You know good and well a test between radiators and a test between Camshafts are TOTALLY unrelated.

_____________________________________________
Jerrome B.
1995 GSX - Race
1997 GST - Drive
1995 GST - Who the hell knows

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

Jeff_99gs	Jun-07-05 09:00 AM
Donating 2GNT member 5473 posts,

#8374, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 14
Jun-07-05 09:01 AM by Jeff_99gs

Originally posted by BigBald
oh man...here we go again..... 1. You pay about the same for an exhaust and receive the same amount of gains. The thing about the exhaust is, that is it with that purcahse. With cams, you results will vary from turbo to turbo and mods of course. 2. Everythning in that test remain constant Jeff....does that sound familiar? Nothing changed but the drop in of the cams. So with that said, what can be a variable in this particular test to make any of the data provided invalid? You know good and well a test between radiators and a test between Camshafts are TOTALLY unrelated.

So how many variables were in my overheating/radiator statement? All I did was drop in a new radiator and my overheating was resolved. Literally 45 minutes after the car was overheating with the good condition stock radiator, it was no longer overheating. That is a controlled "experiment". There were no other variables, yet you insisted repeatedly that there were.

Now think how many variables there are in the effect of a radiator on a cooling system compared to the amount of variables in installing new cams. Each time the cams were installed, the car had to be retuned.
It takes a lot longer than 45 minutes to install a set of cams, let alone the 7 or 8 or however many sets they tested. Who knows how the humidity could have changed during that time, as well as temperature, etc. There were also no dates on the graphs. Those tests could have been done over the course of a week, a month, etc. There isn't nearly enough information there to make a true comparison.

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

Jeff_99gs	Jun-07-05 08:33 AM
Donating 2GNT member 5473 posts,

#8375, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 13

I'm not arguing that you shouldn't get cams. I would just wait until the head is properly built to rev higher. That extra 2,000rpm makes a huge difference. Matt's car starts to really take off at 5,500rpm. Only having 1,500rpm of fast time doesn't seem worth the $600 to me. I just live by the idea of doing something right the first time.

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

BigBald	Jun-07-05 08:39 AM
Member since Oct 22nd 2002 2715 posts,

#8376, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 16

I shifted at 8k on stock head with my 3052. 7k sux.....

_____________________________________________
Jerrome B.
1995 GSX - Race
1997 GST - Drive
1995 GST - Who the hell knows

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

Jeff_99gs	Jun-07-05 08:45 AM
Donating 2GNT member 5473 posts,

#8377, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 17
Jun-07-05 08:45 AM by Jeff_99gs

Originally posted by BigBald
I shifted at 8k on stock head with my 3052. 7k sux.....

You also ran an FP3065 on a stock 2g SMIC.

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

BigBald	Jun-07-05 09:01 AM
Member since Oct 22nd 2002 2715 posts,

#8378, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 18

Originally posted by Jeff_99gs

Originally posted by BigBald I shifted at 8k on stock head with my 3052. 7k sux.....

You also ran an FP3065 on a stock 2g SMIC.

I never had a 3065....lol. I do now have a 3575 and that was run on my FMIC not my SMIC. I also ran a 13.1 on my SMIC with the 3052....lol. It's amazing the things you can do, when told its impossible.

_____________________________________________
Jerrome B.
1995 GSX - Race
1997 GST - Drive
1995 GST - Who the hell knows

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

Jeff_99gs	Jun-07-05 09:03 AM
Donating 2GNT member 5473 posts,

#8379, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 19

Originally posted by BigBald

Originally posted by Jeff_99gs

Originally posted by BigBald I shifted at 8k on stock head with my 3052. 7k sux.....

You also ran an FP3065 on a stock 2g SMIC.

I never had a 3065....lol. I do now have a 3575 and that was run on my FMIC not my SMIC. I also ran a 13.1 on my SMIC with the 3052....lol. It's amazing the things you can do, when told its impossible.

Well yes and I ran 13.2 on the stock SMIC with a 14b. What is the point?

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

HybriDSM	Jun-07-05 09:08 AM
Member since Aug 07th 2002 2407 posts,

#8380, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 19

Originally posted by BigBald

Originally posted by Jeff_99gs

Originally posted by BigBald I shifted at 8k on stock head with my 3052. 7k sux.....

You also ran an FP3065 on a stock 2g SMIC.

I never had a 3065....lol. I do now have a 3575 and that was run on my FMIC not my SMIC. I also ran a 13.1 on my SMIC with the 3052....lol. It's amazing the things you can do, when told its impossible.

You ran a 13.1 on a 10 second turbo. You allowed your intake temps to get to wholly inefficient and dangerous levels by not cooling the air properly. "I ran into a brick wall for a day straight and broke the bricks with my head. Everyone said it couldn't be done." Why would anyone try to do something like that. It obviously doesn't get anything positive done. In fact it really does nothing but hurt.

Oh and this cam example, as Jeff said above, has even more variability than does the radiator example. Radiator can be proven to be effective or ineffective within an hour. Cams, just to compare one set to another takes hours to pull the valve cover, replace the cams, replace the valve cover and retune the car. And that is just for one set. In that time, weather, ambient conditions and many other things can change. The cam example at the absolute best is equal to the radiator one.

It's running again shitheads.

http://www.dsmregistry.com/detail.php?carid=791

HybriDSM@gmail.com ; HybriDSM@hotmail.com

Think for yourself. Question authority does not always mean disagree with authority.

If life were perfect, I'd be Calvin and you'd be Hobbes.

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

BigBald	Jun-07-05 09:54 AM
Member since Oct 22nd 2002 2715 posts,

#8381, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 21
Jun-07-05 09:59 AM by BigBald

1. On the cams.....there was not tune, just a drop in so that eliminates that factor. It is was conducted almost identical to the intake manifold test. So there were no VARIABLES invovled with the testing. AMS is top of the line with the tests they conduct and anything you can think of was accounted for. Radiators and Cams perform differently and are used to totally different things therefore apples and oranges at best. You can keep trying tho.....

2. Noone has run 10s on a 3052 yet so it's not a 10 second turbo. Can it run 10s? Who knows but it wasn't part of my long term plan so i moved on. Am I proud that i ran a 13.1 on that turbo with shitty tune and stock SMIC and 18psi...yes i am. Could I have done better with a FMIC, i am sure I could have. What point are you two trying to make? I already know what happened and why I ran the time I did. And to make another point, at 18psi the 3052 was very effiecient on my stock SMIC on pump gas. I have the logs to prove that.....much better then I got out of the 16g with the same mods at the same level on the same stetch of tuning road. Only variable would be outside temps.

_____________________________________________
Jerrome B.
1995 GSX - Race
1997 GST - Drive
1995 GST - Who the hell knows

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

HybriDSM	Jun-07-05 10:23 AM
Member since Aug 07th 2002 2407 posts,

#8382, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 22

Originally posted by BigBald
1. On the cams.....there was not tune, just a drop in so that eliminates that factor. It is was conducted almost identical to the intake manifold test. So there were no VARIABLES invovled with the testing. 2. Noone has run 10s on a 3052 yet so it's not a 10 second turbo. Can it run 10s? Who knows but it wasn't part of my long term plan so i moved on. Am I proud that i ran a 13.1 on that turbo with shitty tune and stock SMIC...yes i am. Could i have done better with a FMIC, i am sure I could have. What point are you two trying to make? I already know what happened and why I ran the time I did. And to make another point, at 18psi the 3052 was very effiecient on my stock SMIC on pump gas. I have the logs to prove that.....much better then I got out of the 16g with the same mods at the same level.

I am just trying to straighten out some point I believe to be fallacious.

If they didn't tune with cams, then the test is BS. Cams inherently change airflow. Without tuning, that airflow is inefficient. The gains seen by those cams are likely much lower than they should be. It would be like upgrading from a 14b to a 16g without tuning anything. Sure you'll get some more power but likely not nearly as much as you'd get by actually tuning the fuel for that turbo. Cams aren't drop in mods. They are tunable mods. Different cam gears allow for adjustability and since they directly affect air flow, they need appropriate fuel as well.

Also, in terms of the 3052, it is a ~60 lb/minute turbo right? Well small er turbos than that have gone 10's, whether this one has or not. I understand that you saw your logs as efficient on that turbo at 18 psi, but if you only ran a 13.1 on that setup, it tells me that it just didn't make any sense to risk the ill effects of heat soak. It just comes down to a fundamental discrepancy in our schools of thought on modding. I wouldn't risk the heat soak issue with a turbo that large and I really don't see the point in taking that risk. I've been burned by improperly modding and I see just how small the margin for error is in improperly combined parts.

I guess it just comes down to being inherently apart on point of view.

It's running again shitheads.

http://www.dsmregistry.com/detail.php?carid=791

HybriDSM@gmail.com ; HybriDSM@hotmail.com

Think for yourself. Question authority does not always mean disagree with authority.

If life were perfect, I'd be Calvin and you'd be Hobbes.

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

BigBald	Jun-07-05 10:58 AM
Member since Oct 22nd 2002 2715 posts,

#8383, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 23

when it comes to testing, people want to see power gains. The point of that test was to show the different power gains between all those cams....basically which cams will yield more power. Each test used the same tune, I would have to verify with Martin as to if it was tuned with stock cams and tested of if it was juust global compensation and tested. The test proved what it needed to prove and anything beyond that is up to user.

The 3052 flows roughly 52lbs/min which equates to roughly 500hp max. I believe Justin Early holds the record which is a 11.4 if i am not mistaken. As far as the heat soak, the 116octane I used compensated for most the heat soak. When i say shitty tune, I mean i was running crazy timing, extremely rich, and getting no knock. It was a chilly night to say the least as i beleive the temps where around 50 degrees. Would i do it again...prolly, would i advise anyone else to do it, prolly not. It all comes down to what you are comfortable/confident with. I am very condfident in my tuning/modding abilites so i will push the envelope sort to speak. I just like to give others the option of whether or not to push the envelope with their car instead of telling them it is totally impossible.

_____________________________________________
Jerrome B.
1995 GSX - Race
1997 GST - Drive
1995 GST - Who the hell knows

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

eclipzGST	Jun-07-05 01:11 PM
Old School 2GNTer 7335 posts,

#8384, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 24

Jerrome, you running 13's with that turbo is like someone bragging about running 17's on a 14B. End it.
If you guys can't stay on topic, I'm going to delete all the useless crap from this thread...

__________________________________________________________
-Tony <--- NOT asian.
'06 Wicked White EVO IX

Originally posted by Avenger
When I raise the BS flag ... it's a really big fucking flag and I raise it really fucking high too.

"Never whistle while your pissing." ~The illuminatus Trilogy

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

BigBald	Jun-07-05 02:04 PM
Member since Oct 22nd 2002 2715 posts,

#8385, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 25

I am not bragging about anything....merely making a statement.

_____________________________________________
Jerrome B.
1995 GSX - Race
1997 GST - Drive
1995 GST - Who the hell knows

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

PowerEclipses	Jun-07-05 04:45 PM
Donating 2GNT member 3215 posts,

#8386, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 26

flyin, you might want to get some new valve seals, and some new lifters that way you dont burn any oil and you get rid of the lifter tick if you have any

Boca Raton, Florida
95 Eclipse GS- sold
99 Eclipse GSX- 386awhp
98 Eclipse GS- sold
92 Prelude

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

HybriDSM	Jun-07-05 05:37 PM
Member since Aug 07th 2002 2407 posts,

#8387, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 27
Jun-07-05 05:38 PM by HybriDSM

Buy 3g lifters. Basically all lifter tick goes bye bye. Oh and I didn't mistype, I really do mean 3g lifters.

It's running again shitheads.

http://www.dsmregistry.com/detail.php?carid=791

HybriDSM@gmail.com ; HybriDSM@hotmail.com

Think for yourself. Question authority does not always mean disagree with authority.

If life were perfect, I'd be Calvin and you'd be Hobbes.

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

FlyinEsi	Jun-08-05 09:46 AM
Donating 2GNT member 5187 posts,

#8388, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 28

Head is scheduled to go in on Monday.

3g lifters...for the 4-cyl motor or the v6?

Head options...I'm doing stock components until I get more money together for a decent built up, along with a motor that can use it.

BUT,

I'm getting a complete lookover for $45, that is hot tanking it (?), vacuum testing, and check for warping.

For $60 I get it cleaned and decked, but for an additional $20, I can get it decked .020 to raise compression...worth it or not???

Any reason why I should not raise my compression a little, because my head gasket is going to lower it a little bit.

___________________________________

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

HybriDSM	Jun-08-05 10:09 AM
Member since Aug 07th 2002 2407 posts,

#8389, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 29

Originally posted by FlyinEsi
Head is scheduled to go in on Monday. 3g lifters...for the 4-cyl motor or the v6?

http://www.store.partsdinosaur.com/product224.html That should do you right. emoji

You need 16.

As far as other head work, getting lightly higher compreeion seems fine. Nothing really harmful there especially since you are lower compression with the HG. Get all the services you mentioned. Deck, pressure test, hot tank etc. Do it once, do it right.

It's running again shitheads.

http://www.dsmregistry.com/detail.php?carid=791

HybriDSM@gmail.com ; HybriDSM@hotmail.com

Think for yourself. Question authority does not always mean disagree with authority.

If life were perfect, I'd be Calvin and you'd be Hobbes.

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

FlyinEsi	Jun-08-05 10:35 AM
Donating 2GNT member 5187 posts,

#8390, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 30

Hybrid, you rock!!! That company is located right here in Phoenix...saved on shipping.

___________________________________

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

HybriDSM	Jun-08-05 11:44 AM
Member since Aug 07th 2002 2407 posts,

#8391, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 31

Thanks Dan, and you know you can always IM me for any info you might need. I am using the 3g lifters in my rebuilt engine now and I have forgotten what lifter tick is. They are a great little thing to do.

It's running again shitheads.

http://www.dsmregistry.com/detail.php?carid=791

HybriDSM@gmail.com ; HybriDSM@hotmail.com

Think for yourself. Question authority does not always mean disagree with authority.

If life were perfect, I'd be Calvin and you'd be Hobbes.

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

FlyinEsi	Jun-08-05 01:15 PM
Donating 2GNT member 5187 posts,

#8392, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 32
Jun-08-05 01:19 PM by FlyinEsi

Sweet....

Current Parts in Garage:
-Fluidyne Radiator
-Multi-Layer Metal Headgasket
-ARP Head Studs
-Timing Belt
-Balance Shaft Belt
-Aluminum Water Pump
-2 Gallons of Extended Life Antifreeze emoji
-Water Wetter

On Shipment
-3G Lifters

Work to be done
-Head hot tanked, vacuum checked, decked

Left to Buy
-Timing Belt Tensioner Bearing and/or Adjustment assembly (maybe)
-2nd 12" Spal Fan
-Chilton or Haynes manual

IF MY CAR STILL OVERHEATS AFTER THIS, I'M GOING TO BE SOOOOO PISSED!!!

___________________________________

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

HybriDSM	Jun-08-05 01:23 PM
Member since Aug 07th 2002 2407 posts,

#8393, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 33

Thermostat?

It's running again shitheads.

http://www.dsmregistry.com/detail.php?carid=791

HybriDSM@gmail.com ; HybriDSM@hotmail.com

Think for yourself. Question authority does not always mean disagree with authority.

If life were perfect, I'd be Calvin and you'd be Hobbes.

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

FlyinEsi	Jun-08-05 01:30 PM
Donating 2GNT member 5187 posts,

#8394, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 34

Originally posted by HybriDSM
Thermostat?

Already bought that two weeks ago when this problem first started. So I guess I should have included a "Already bought" column. emoji

___________________________________

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

Hult250R	Jun-08-05 02:06 PM
Donating 2GNT member 2017 posts,

#8395, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 30
Jun-08-05 02:08 PM by Hult250R

Originally posted by HybriDSM
http://www.store.partsdinosaur.com/product224.html That should do you right. emoji

You need 16. As far as other head work, getting lightly higher compreeion seems fine. Nothing really harmful there especially since you are lower compression with the HG. Get all the services you mentioned. Deck, pressure test, hot tank etc. Do it once, do it right.

Matt, will those fit a 6 bolt? are all of them the same?
Ive been meaning to get the upgraded lifters too. Im getting nasty lifter tick and I think its part of my phantom knock issue too.
If I just order 16 of these Im good to go??

----------------------------------------

I used to have a 420A...

'92 TSi AWD

11.8 @ 119mph
470awhp 405 ft/lb torque
30psi on E85 w/ Borg Warner S256 Turbo

My DSM Registry: http://www.dsmregistry.com/166

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

HybriDSM	Jun-08-05 04:38 PM
Member since Aug 07th 2002 2407 posts,

#8396, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 36

Originally posted by Hult250R

Originally posted by HybriDSM http://www.store.partsdinosaur.com/product224.html That should do you right. emoji

You need 16. As far as other head work, getting lightly higher compreeion seems fine. Nothing really harmful there especially since you are lower compression with the HG. Get all the services you mentioned. Deck, pressure test, hot tank etc. Do it once, do it right.

Matt, will those fit a 6 bolt? are all of them the same? Ive been meaning to get the upgraded lifters too. Im getting nasty lifter tick and I think its part of my phantom knock issue too. If I just order 16 of these Im good to go??

Yep. 16 of the 3g lifters in any 4G63 will take that tick and make it go away. All they are are the exact same lifters as ours, but with larger oil passages that help get the head lubricated faster. Exact same part, different hole size.

It's running again shitheads.

http://www.dsmregistry.com/detail.php?carid=791

HybriDSM@gmail.com ; HybriDSM@hotmail.com

Think for yourself. Question authority does not always mean disagree with authority.

If life were perfect, I'd be Calvin and you'd be Hobbes.

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

Hult250R	Jun-08-05 04:59 PM
Donating 2GNT member 2017 posts,

#8397, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 37

Cool, Now I just gotta find $150 worth of change in my couch cushions

----------------------------------------

I used to have a 420A...

'92 TSi AWD

11.8 @ 119mph
470awhp 405 ft/lb torque
30psi on E85 w/ Borg Warner S256 Turbo

My DSM Registry: http://www.dsmregistry.com/166

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

eclipzGST	Jun-08-05 09:25 PM
Old School 2GNTer 7335 posts,

#8398, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 38

Originally posted by FlyinEsi
Left to Buy --Chilton or Haynes manual

You don't have a CHILTONS?????????????????????

__________________________________________________________
-Tony <--- NOT asian.
'06 Wicked White EVO IX

Originally posted by Avenger
When I raise the BS flag ... it's a really big fucking flag and I raise it really fucking high too.

"Never whistle while your pissing." ~The illuminatus Trilogy

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

BigBald	Jun-09-05 04:25 AM
Member since Oct 22nd 2002 2715 posts,

#8399, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 39

Wow....DSM's should come stock with SMIM, Cams, Chiltons manual and AAA Memebership.

_____________________________________________
Jerrome B.
1995 GSX - Race
1997 GST - Drive
1995 GST - Who the hell knows

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

FlyinEsi	Jun-09-05 04:29 AM
Donating 2GNT member 5187 posts,

#8400, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 40

Heh, I never have had a project big enough to need a Chiltons. As stupid as I may sound when I type on here, I really do know how to fix a lot of shit on my car. And a lot of work has been done by my father who is a mechanic. emoji

Where do I get a Chiltons? Autozone has Haynes. I want Chiltons.

___________________________________

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

slowmitsu	Jun-09-05 05:02 AM
Member since May 26th 2005 343 posts,

#8401, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 41

Originally posted by FlyinEsi
Where do I get a Chiltons? Autozone has Haynes. I want Chiltons.

Any of the other big name auto parts stores. NAPA, Checker, etc.

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

BigBald	Jun-09-05 08:11 AM
Member since Oct 22nd 2002 2715 posts,

#8402, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 41
Jun-09-05 08:12 AM by BigBald

Originally posted by FlyinEsi
Heh, I never have had a project big enough to need a Chiltons. As stupid as I may sound when I type on here, I really do know how to fix a lot of shit on my car. And a lot of work has been done by my father who is a mechanic. emoji

Where do I get a Chiltons? Autozone has Haynes. I want Chiltons.

I got mines from Amazon.com.....

And you should know how to fix shit.....once you purchase a DSM , it automatically certifies you to be a mechanic.

_____________________________________________
Jerrome B.
1995 GSX - Race
1997 GST - Drive
1995 GST - Who the hell knows

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

FlyinEsi	Jun-09-05 12:11 PM
Donating 2GNT member 5187 posts,

#8403, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 43

haha, no doubt, or at least mechanic in training...

I got the Chilton's covered, taloniized is hooking me up with his.

Sweetness, I'm so fucking stoked for this project. Don't like the money that has gone into it, but it will be fun.

I only wish I was doing a full rebuild though. Damn, I'm clear down in there, might as well pull the rest of this shit and just do it.

___________________________________

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

HybriDSM	Jun-09-05 01:47 PM
Member since Aug 07th 2002 2407 posts,

#8404, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 44

Originally posted by FlyinEsi
Damn, I'm clear down in there, might as well pull the rest of this shit and just do it.

My thoughts exactly. I wanted to have it apart once and only once. Once you take everything apart, you'll know exactly what I mean. That's why I did it in one push. Can you swing the full rebuild now?

It's running again shitheads.

http://www.dsmregistry.com/detail.php?carid=791

HybriDSM@gmail.com ; HybriDSM@hotmail.com

Think for yourself. Question authority does not always mean disagree with authority.

If life were perfect, I'd be Calvin and you'd be Hobbes.

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

FlyinEsi	Jun-10-05 04:24 AM
Donating 2GNT member 5187 posts,

#8405, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 45
Jun-10-05 04:25 AM by FlyinEsi

Originally posted by HybriDSM

Originally posted by FlyinEsi Damn, I'm clear down in there, might as well pull the rest of this shit and just do it.

My thoughts exactly. I wanted to have it apart once and only once. Once you take everything apart, you'll know exactly what I mean. That's why I did it in one push. Can you swing the full rebuild now?

Not a chance.

But I really don't want to anyway. Why replace what isn't broken. I'll just run on this motor until it blows. But I really don't have enough horsepower to make it blow anyway, so I'll go with it till it does.

___________________________________

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

slowmitsu	Jun-10-05 04:45 AM
Member since May 26th 2005 343 posts,

#8406, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 46
Jun-10-05 04:50 AM by slowmitsu

Originally posted by FlyinEsi
But I really don't have enough horsepower to make it blow anyway, so I'll go with it till it does.

Shitting tuning will easily pop a motor with 200 chp or 600 chp. Not saying your tuning is out of whack but that's just food for thought. Being conservative and cognizant will increase longevity...baring bad luck of course.

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

BigBald	Jun-10-05 05:20 AM
Member since Oct 22nd 2002 2715 posts,

#8407, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 47

pull it all

_____________________________________________
Jerrome B.
1995 GSX - Race
1997 GST - Drive
1995 GST - Who the hell knows

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

PowerEclipses	Jun-11-05 05:10 PM
Donating 2GNT member 3215 posts,

#8408, "RE: Head coming off...what else should I do"
In response to Reply # 48

Originally posted by BigBald
pull it all

ooo yeah thats what im talkin bout emoji

Boca Raton, Florida
95 Eclipse GS- sold
99 Eclipse GSX- 386awhp
98 Eclipse GS- sold
92 Prelude

Report This Post to Admin

Printer-friendly copy | Reply | Reply with quote | Top

Top

topic #8359

Previous topic | Next topic

Powered by DCForum+ Version 2.2
Copyright 1997-2005 DCScripts.com, Copyright 2005-2026 2gnt.com

Generated in 0.062 seconds, executing 112 queries.