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Subject: "O2 data, and analysis (well, my best guess)" Previous topic | Next topic
ModeratorVX100Feb-04-02 01:36 PM
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#13785, "O2 data, and analysis (well, my best guess)"




          

here is the O2 data from my runs.

1st run, 2nd gear run, safc set to 0 across the board. 3000 to 4000 rpms 0.96V. From 4000-4700 rpms it was a bit leaner, around 0.94V with the largest dip being 0.92V at 4300 rpms. Then from 4700 rpms up we're talking 0.98V (real rich) so it did, at stock settings, drop a bit at 4300 rpms, but it was a very shallow dip in the

2nd run; 2nd gear pull; safc: 3k rpms 0, 4k -5, 5k -7, 6k and up -9
2500-3800 rpms O2 went from 0.96V to 0.88V. Between 3800-4700 rpms it leans to 0.62V. From 5100 to 6000 rpms O2 was about 0.90V. From 6000 rpms up to redline O2 was 0.94V. Timing was at 20 degrees, dropped to 17 degrees at 4800 rpms then increased to 23 degrees at 6000 and stayed there to redline. This run, the O2 voltage leaned out.

3rd run; 2nd gear pull; same safc settings, the O2 voltage and timing curve was the same. It was running leaner between 3800-4800 rpms, but the O2 only leaned to 0.81V at 4300. Then I shifted to 3rd gear. The O2 voltage held rather steady at 0.88V between 4800 to 6000 rpms in 3rd gear. In 2nd at about 4300 rpms again, it leaned out, but not as badly. In 3rd gear I think I've got the tuning right. O2 voltage is at 0.88V in the rpm range the car runs at the 2nd half of the 1/4 mile, which is about 12.7 to 1, right where you want it for power on pump gas.

4th run; 3rd gear pull from low rpms; safc: 2K -3, 3K -4, 4K -4, 4.5K -2, 5K -7, 6K and up -10. I richened it up a bit at 4.5K rpms to compensate the leaning out. From 2300 rpms to 3000 rpms O2 were about 0.98V, 3000-4000 rpms O2 were about 0.94V to 0.96V, 4000-4400 rpms O2 was about 0.90V, 4400-5100 rpms about 0.94V. I shut it down before I got to the 5-6K range in the previous run. Again, a slight leaning out in the same range, but not as noticeable.

5th run and 6th run; 2nd gear pull, same safc settings. O2 was steady from 3000-6900 rpms around 0.92V or so, but leaned to 0.69V at 4300 rpms again. The voltage drop was from 3900 to4600 rpms.

7th run, same safc settings, 2nd gear then 3rd gear pull. O2 voltage was the same in 2nd gear except at 4200 rpms it only leaned down to 0.81V. From 4700-5300 rpms in 3rd the O2 stayed at about 0.88V again.

8th run, 2nd gear pull, safc setting the same EXCEPT I put the setting at 4500 rpms at 0. The O2 voltage was steady again, and only dropped to 0.82V at 4200 rpms, with almost no drop in O2 voltage before and after 4200 rpms. It was a much smoother O2 graph than the previous runs.

OK, lots of data here! This is what I make of it.

No SAFC settings, in 2nd gear, there's a "slightly leaner spot" in the fuel map. Why??? Best guess, this is where the torque drops off in the mid range (like most non vtec DOHC cars) and they lean it a bit from the factory to bump up the power where the torque drops off here.

In 3rd gear, the tuning is about right from 5-6K rpms. Keeping the safc setting higher at 4.5K seems to help around the "lean spot" in 3rd.

In 2nd, keeping the safc setting higher at 4.5K seems to help the lean spot too. But for some reason when the safc is set leaner, even if it's just around this rpm point, the O2 voltage seems to drop more that if there is no safc setting. I have no idea why.

I'm going to try more baseline runs, and I'm going to try comparing those to leaning it only ABOVE 4500 rpms. Example, 4000 rpms 0, 4500 rpms 0, 5000 rpms -7, ect... I'd like to see if the O2 drops alot if the safc is set to 0 at and before 4500 rpms.

Realistically, this setting is all I'll need since except for the launch you don't see less than 5K rpms in 2nd or 3rd at the drag strip, and the launch in 1st happens so fast, who cares if it runs lean. But, I think this should be figured out.

"Tutto fa brodo."

Todd Scungio
98 RS
15.173 @ 90.70 MPH

And also a 2011 Ralliart

  

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Replies to this topic
RE: O2 data, and analysis (well, my best guess), Teameclipse804, Feb-04-02 01:48 PM, #1
RE: O2 data, and analysis (well, my best guess), ModeratorVX100, Feb-05-02 01:43 AM, #2
      RE: O2 data, and analysis (well, my best guess), TeamMichael_97RS, Feb-05-02 06:00 AM, #3
           RE: O2 data, and analysis (well, my best guess), Kiku, Feb-05-02 06:31 AM, #4
                RE: O2 data, and analysis (well, my best guess), ModeratorVX100, Feb-05-02 07:23 AM, #5
                     RE: O2 data, and analysis (well, my best guess), Kiku, Feb-07-02 09:37 AM, #6

Teameclipse804Feb-04-02 01:48 PM
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#13786, "RE: O2 data, and analysis (well, my best guess)"
In response to Reply # 0




          

>Between 3800-4700 rpms it leans to 0.62V

That is pretty much EXACTLY what my car does except it leans out in first gear only (auto) and it's somewhere between 3500 to 4000 rpms. That's just an estimate of the rpm range where it drops down to 6 or 7 bars on the a/f gague. So you said that leaning out the AFC helped? I don't know much about AFC tuning, so does leaning out the AFC cause the ECU to think it is running lean, so then it should help the ECU richen things up? Is that how it works? Anyone else have any ideas on why it would run lean in the middle rpm range, and why only in certain gears?

________________________________________

2004 WRX - WR Blue Pearl
1997 Eclipse GS - Royal Sapphire Pearl

  

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ModeratorVX100Feb-05-02 01:43 AM
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#13787, "RE: O2 data, and analysis (well, my best guess)"
In response to Reply # 1




          

At 4300 rpms or so, running negative correction on the safc seems to cause the car to run leaner than I want it to. But at other rpms ponts, especially 5000 rpms to 7000 rpms the safc is doing a good job of adjusting the air fuel ratio, as in 3rd gear from 5K-6K rpms the O2 voltage is right around 0.88V, when stock it's usually 0.94 or 0.96V

Unfortunately that's not exactly how the safc and the car's computer work together.

The car knows how much fuel to add based on the map sensor signal (and tons of othe things, but that's for another post). The safc interrupts that signal and makes it higher or lower (based on how you set the safc). The computer will add more or less fuel than it is actually supposed to because the safc is feeding it an altered map sensor signal (a % higher or lower voltage than it is supposed to).

But, even with the safc set to 0 (no correctin, essentially it isn't there) the car still went "leaner" around 4300 rpms (from my run, it actually wasn't runnign lean, but it was leaner than at other points in the rpm range.)

"Tutto fa brodo."

Todd Scungio
98 RS
15.173 @ 90.70 MPH

And also a 2011 Ralliart

  

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TeamMichael_97RSFeb-05-02 06:00 AM
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#13788, "RE: O2 data, and analysis (well, my best guess)"
In response to Reply # 2


          

Todd can you read your trim values with your software?

"The fastest draw is when the sword never leaves the scabbard,
The strongest way to block, is never to provoke a blow,
And the cleanest cut is the one withheld."



Michael J. Kulaga
e-mail: Michael_97RS@2gntDSM.zzn.com aol IM: MJKulga
http://highlander.dsmpower.com/

Injen CAI, 55mm TB, Hooker 4-1 Stepped Header, GS-T Muffler, AFX UDP, S-AFC, 8.5mm Magnecor Wires, SS Clutch Line, NRG Susp. Motor Mount Ins., FU/RU/RL STBs, TSW Blade 17x7.5, Bridgestone Potenza RE730 215/45ZR-17. Front KVR Cross-Drilled Rotors and Carbon Fiber Pads

To Be Installed: Ported/Polished Intake Manifold 1/2, Rear disc brake conversion kit, SS Brake Lines, Rear KVR Cross Drilled Rotors and KVR Carbon Fiber Kevlar Pads, Crane Ignition Amp

Firefly:
Mal: You don't know me, son, so let me put this to you plainly: If I ever kill you, you'll be awake. You'll be facing me. And you'll be armed.

  

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KikuFeb-05-02 06:31 AM
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#13789, "RE: O2 data, and analysis (well, my best guess)"
In response to Reply # 3




          

can you tell me about your setup? what turbo setup, size of injectors, what FPR ratio, etc...

thanks. BTW, GREAT data!


_________________
Vinnie Lima
vlima@csc.com
AIM: Kiku888
1997 Chrysler Sebring "Silver XTC"
I4 420a w/ HRC Stage 2.45 w/ FMIC
14.7@97 mph@6psi
Proud member of the
ASOG BoOsT JuNkIe Crew

  

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ModeratorVX100Feb-05-02 07:23 AM
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#13790, "RE: O2 data, and analysis (well, my best guess)"
In response to Reply # 4




          

Mike, yes I can read fuel trim values with the pocketlogger (short term and long term). Do you think logging fuel trim will help us to figure out what is going on?

And, Kiku, sorry this is WITHOUT a turbo, the mods listed below are what I've got. So the injectors and fuel system are stock.

Still, I think it can help, so that turbo owners don't lean out in the midrange and damage their cars.

"Tutto fa brodo."

Todd Scungio
98 RS
15.173 @ 90.70 MPH

And also a 2011 Ralliart

  

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KikuFeb-07-02 09:37 AM
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#13791, "RE: O2 data, and analysis (well, my best guess)"
In response to Reply # 5




          

doh sorry now i feel stupid for not reading your sig emoji


_________________
Vinnie Lima
vlima@csc.com
AIM: Kiku888
1997 Chrysler Sebring "Silver XTC"
I4 420a w/ HRC Stage 2.45 w/ FMIC
14.7@97 mph@6psi
Proud member of the
ASOG BoOsT JuNkIe Crew

  

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