I got some runs yesterday and today with the pocket logger. I can't figure out how to get the data into a spreadsheet (or if it's even possible with the OBD2 version) so I'm just going to have to explain what the heck was going with the runs.

First off, I did two baseline runs with my SAFC set to zero across the whole RPM range. (I did these runs today) I also logged timing with these runs.

First baseline run, I floored it in 2nd gear from 4300 rpms to 7000 rpms. The O2 voltage held pretty much steady at 0.96V to 0.98 V and at one brief point at 6170 rpms it hit 1.00V. The timing started off at 15 degrees, climbed steadily to 20 degrees at 5800 rpms, and stayed there until 7K rpms.

Second baseline run, I floored it in 2nd gear at about 2700 rpms all the way up to redline. From 2700 to 5000 rpms the O2 voltage varied from 0.94 to 0.96V. At 5000 rpms it stayed steady at 0.96V, then at 6000-7000 rpms it went to 0.98V. The timing started off at 20 degrees, very slowly decreased to 15 degrees at 5K, then slowly increased to 20 deg at 6K and held steady at 20 deg to 7K.

With these baseline runs I expected the O2 voltage to be very high, but I have no idea why the timing fell off a bit at 5K thne went back up with the second one (I was running 93 octane, it shouldn't have been knocking). Still, this shows at WOT our cars hit 20 degrees advance timing and then nothing. WE NEED MORE TIMING ADVANCE! I'm still working of the apexi ITC. If I can't get it to work, I'm going to use something else, since this now proves I need it for more power.

OK, now the SAFC run (the part you've been waiting for!). I did several runs in third gear up to 5600 rpms, but the results were the same as the second gear pull (well, up to 5600 rpms). The O2 for all three of the third gear runs with the safc adjusted fluctuated around from between 0.87 and 0.90 V, but basically stayed at 0.88V from 4600 to 6000 or so rpms.

The second gear run (with a little acceleration in 3rd after it as well) I went from about 3700 rpms up to redline (7K rpms). The O2 voltage climbed from about 0.1V since initially I had my foot off the throttle, climbed and then leveled off at 5K rpms. At 5K rpms the O2 voltage was at about 0.90 to 0.88V (more often at 0.88V). At 6K rpms it went up to 0.92V and held there until 7K. Then in 3rd gear for a little bit (between 4800 and 5200 rpms) it held steady at 0.88V (once the O2 voltage steadied out after I closed and opened the throttle to shift).

And, from 4K to 7K rpms, with that run I datalogged intake temp as well. The intake manifold and the temp sensor heat soaks big time. It went from 91 deg F at 4K to 66 deg F at 7K as cold air (40 deg F I think) kept flowing over the temp sensor.

The SAFC setting were the same as when I ran my best 1/4 mile time, 3K and lower rpms 0, 4K rpms -5, 5K rpms -7, 6K rpms and up -9 correction.

The SAFC is defenitley doing its job (0.98 to 0.88V, yea it's making the car run leaner) The data leads me to believe my setting were pretty good (since I was aiming for about 0.87-0.88V) but despite going to -9 correction, it looks like the car richens up a bit more above 6K rpms, which explains the jump from 0.88V to 0.92 V.

Next time I get a chance I'd like to start off at a lower rpm to see what is happening at aroud 4K. It looks like the O2 sensor needs to catch up a bit once you floor it, so flooring at lets say 2K in 2nd gear should give it time to get to the proper voltage soon enough to give me data at the mid range.

More runs above 6K in 2nd would be nice to see how consistantly it stays at 0.92V, and to see if I can nudge it down a bit more.

Also, logging a drag run would also be preferred, but I'll have to wait a while before that happens. This is, so far, a good start I think. I'll send over more relevant data as I get it. And, comments and input on tuning strategy and anything else is very much appreciated!

If you get a palm thingy, be careful the damn screens on the things scratch really easily.

"Tutto fa brodo."

Todd Scungio
98 RS
15.173 @ 90.70 MPH

And also a 2011 Ralliart

Cool info!!! Errr, what does it all mean??? Hehehe. But anyways, if ur having problems scratching the screen of ur palm, there are protective covers out there for sale. Its like putting a film over ur screen so they don't scratch. I think u could get it at any best buy...

SonicYan aka Mikey
1997 Eclipse RS
Pinoy Reppin' SoCal 2GNT
Best: 16.35 @ 83.05 MPH

Sorry, can't help with the tuning, but get a Brando screen protector. Search for it - they were previously only sold from Hong Kong, but now they are distributed in the US. They are very pricy (about 11 bucks), but the best screen protector ever. It is reuseable AND washable. The best thing is that it is reuseable so every time I messed up putting on the protector, I didn't have to get a new one. All the other screen protectors use an adhesive that can only be put on once, so if you get air bubbles, you can't fix it - you have to use a new one. I found out about Brando from Palm message boards, and I truly think it is the best, and well worth the 11 bucks.

________________________________________

2004 WRX - WR Blue Pearl
1997 Eclipse GS - Royal Sapphire Pearl

Hey Todd, what do your EGTs look like at 6k-7k with that -9 correction on the AFC?

-"Easy Mac"
05 Mazda RX-8 (RR8 #88)
99 Eclipse RS 398whp & 372lb-ft

Since Our car controls the timing like that, would putting premium fuel in the car allow it to advance the timing more than if we put regular in??? Could you check to see if there is any difference???

Toney
'97 RS 5 Speed (totaled)
15.4606@88.42 Mph
96 Toyota Celica GT
88 Toyota Supra NA-T (w/ sports package)
Got Boost?? Hell yeah I-6 turbo powah baby!

Todd,

It would be safer to say your car gets 20deg timing at full rpms. Try adding more fuel. Armond and I have datalogged anywhere from 42deg advance to only 15 depending on the state of tune. Pretty wide scope. This is from datalogging on the street and on numerous dyno runs. The only way to get a general picture of what is going on with our cars is to have enough people do some logging and post results which can then be put together to get a general picture. The funny thing is the more time I spend with looking out how our timing works the more it confuses me. I honestly no longer know what the hell is going on with it.

05 Mazda RX-8
06 Lotus Elise

Hey Todd,
What datalogger do you have and where did you get it? I have been looking at the OBD-2 datalogger but I don't have a laptop.




current status unknown

http://hometown.aol.com/ohshootuhh/

Perf:
KYB AGX Struts
Neuspeed Sport Springs
5 Strut Bars (2 F/U, F/L, R/U, R/L)
Sprint Front Camber Kit
$15 Rear Camber Kit
Corbin's A/F Gauge
MSD DIS-2 Ignition System
Some Regrind Cams that need High Compression (which I don't have)
Ported Intake Manifold
Ported Throttle Body
Drop in K&N Filter and open airbox
Custom 2 1/2 inch exhaust with Dual DTM Muffler
Empty Catalytic Convertor
Energy Suspension Motor Mount inserts
Hurricane_GS Short Shifter
Symborsky Shift Kit
Clutchmasters Stage 3 Modular
225/50/16inch Wheels and Tires


Audio:
Alpine CD Head Unit
Alpine Flex4 25W X 4 for Fronts and Rears
Alpine V-12 450W X 1 for Subs
Infinity Reference Series 5 1/4 and 1 inch tweeter component systems for fronts and rears
Blaupunkt 3 way 6x9's in the rears
3 MTX 5000 10" 12 ohm subs running 4 ohms mono

Flame Red SRT-4 GT40,8.5:1 Built Shortblock, Brian Crower Stage 2 Cams, etc etc etc...

Sonic, eclipse804 thanks I'll look into getting a screen protector

Avenger, I do not have an EGT gauge, that's a future mod I'll need to do.

1tuffRS, I was using 93 octane for all the runs

Chris, the fuel doesn't seem to make a difference. The timing goes to 20 deg advance if it's leaned out or full rich. I didn't log it but my friend looked at the timing when I had the SAFC set to zero and I gunned it. I'll add that to the list of stuff to test inthe future.

Fast420A, I wasn't using a laptop, I was unsing a handspring visor. See www.pocketlogger.com for more details

"Tutto fa brodo."

Todd Scungio
98 RS
15.173 @ 90.70 MPH

And also a 2011 Ralliart

no, no, no, I know you were using 93 octane. What im saying is would using 93 octane versus 87 allow the car to advance timing more and thus produce more power. I know if the engine sees knock it will pull timing so the less prone you are to detonation the more timing advance you see. You know what i mean??

Toney
'97 RS 5 Speed (totaled)
15.4606@88.42 Mph
96 Toyota Celica GT
88 Toyota Supra NA-T (w/ sports package)
Got Boost?? Hell yeah I-6 turbo powah baby!

when i datalogged my car on one run in cali, i was gettin timin advance from 14 degrees to 26 degrees depending on throttle position and rpms.

dont really know what that means, but figured i should mention it. that was on 87 octane

03 srt-4 13.130@112.47mph (n2o, stock turbo, 10/2003)
now: 20g, portfueler, bpu+++ (track/dyno times tbd...)

i farted on your wiki

Oh, I get your question now.

Yes, you are right, you should be able to run MORE timing advance with a higher octane gas.

BUT, our cars are tuned to run on 87 octane, so if you put MORE octane in there, it will not advance timing any more, the computer just won't do it. (I was running 93 to prevent knock from running leaner than stock, just in case)

So, if the computer won't do what we want, we'll just have to "convince" it to do what we want

"Tutto fa brodo."

Todd Scungio
98 RS
15.173 @ 90.70 MPH

And also a 2011 Ralliart

Yep and that's the difference between our ECU and the Neons, the Neon will take advantage of the 93, and I think advancee/retard a greater number of degrees of timing...

What in/out are you using on S-AFC? I was playing around the other day and am curious... Plus the colder weather is messing with readings... New this, new that... just curious as to your Pressure in/out on S-AFC.

On a side not I have an ignition amp coming so I'll be messing with timing soon too. Not as in depth as with an ITC but, some timing none the less.

"The fastest draw is when the sword never leaves the scabbard,
The strongest way to block, is never to provoke a blow,
And the cleanest cut is the one withheld."

Michael J. Kulaga
e-mail: Michael_97RS@2gntDSM.zzn.com aol IM: MJKulga
http://highlander.dsmpower.com/

All Motor Beast in the Making

Injen CAI, 55mm TB, Hooker 4-1 Stepped Header, GS-T Muffler, AFX UDP, S-AFC, 8.5mm Magnecor Wires, SS Clutch Line, NRG Susp. Motor Mount Ins., FU/RU/RL STBs, TSW Blade 17x7.5, Bridgestone Potenza RE730 215/45ZR-17. Front KVR Cross-Drilled Rotors and Carbon Fiber Pads

To Be Installed: Ported/Polished Intake Manifold, Rear disc brake conversion kit, SS Brake Lines, Rear KVR Cross Drilled Rotors and KVR Carbon Fiber Kevlar Pads

Firefly:
Mal: You don't know me, son, so let me put this to you plainly: If I ever kill you, you'll be awake. You'll be facing me. And you'll be armed.

If I remember correctly Mike, the SAFC is set to 7 in and 7 out, or 6 in and 6 out. I'm not sure if that REALLY makes a difference, as long as both numbers are the same.

The cold weathe shouldn't affect it too greatly, as the SAFC does a percentage correction on the actual reading from the MAP sensor, so if you are getting a little more air from the weather being cold, the MAP sensor voltage will be higher to begin with.

And, keep me informed as to how the Ignition apm works out for you, such as how many degrees you can advance with it, if it actually works. Becasue, so far, I haven't figured out if the ITC actually works for our cars or not, so I'd like to know if there are other options out there.

"Tutto fa brodo."

Todd Scungio
98 RS
15.173 @ 90.70 MPH

And also a 2011 Ralliart

I see about 27 degrees of timing advance from my ecu on a good run at wot. I think something is wrong with your car. I would replace the knock sensor at least to see fi thta fixes it. you shoudl hav emroe timing than that, and it shoudl change pretty fluently with knock (i.e. if you lean it out too much, it shoudl be noticeable on the graph immediately.)

A.D.P.
bring it on............

A.D.P.
"...If you do too much, people become dependant. If you do to little, people loose hope. If you do it right, people won't be sure you've done anything at all."
bring it on...........

Well Todd If you get anymore advance you may be much closer to 14's than you think!



current status unknown

http://hometown.aol.com/ohshootuhh/

Perf:
KYB AGX Struts
Neuspeed Sport Springs
5 Strut Bars (2 F/U, F/L, R/U, R/L)
Sprint Front Camber Kit
$15 Rear Camber Kit
Corbin's A/F Gauge
MSD DIS-2 Ignition System
Some Regrind Cams that need High Compression (which I don't have)
Ported Intake Manifold
Ported Throttle Body
Drop in K&N Filter and open airbox
Custom 2 1/2 inch exhaust with Dual DTM Muffler
Empty Catalytic Convertor
Energy Suspension Motor Mount inserts
Hurricane_GS Short Shifter
Symborsky Shift Kit
Clutchmasters Stage 3 Modular
225/50/16inch Wheels and Tires


Audio:
Alpine CD Head Unit
Alpine Flex4 25W X 4 for Fronts and Rears
Alpine V-12 450W X 1 for Subs
Infinity Reference Series 5 1/4 and 1 inch tweeter component systems for fronts and rears
Blaupunkt 3 way 6x9's in the rears
3 MTX 5000 10" 12 ohm subs running 4 ohms mono

Flame Red SRT-4 GT40,8.5:1 Built Shortblock, Brian Crower Stage 2 Cams, etc etc etc...