i got a 95 talon esi turbo, got it cheap because the turbo setup was fucked, but anyway.. i just drove it home about a mile and a half, and even tho most of the issues were sorted out (or so he said), the turbo is smoking.. smells like coolant though, might just have spilled some topping it up, so we'll see what happens with that.. but it also has some shaft play i don't think was there when i left

i am not sure why that may be. i looked the whole thing over before i left, the oil send is a -4AN SS braided line that comes from behind the block and goes to the top of the turbo... it is definitely getting oil... and the oil return looks like a 3/8" NPT flange, to a -8AN fitting, and then it looks like he put a -8AN hose end and then there is a big rubber hose to the pan, which has a -8AN bung welded right into it with the same -8AN hose end. no leaks from either the turbo or oil pan side.

but i was searching on here and it sounded like you were supposed to put the bung towards the third bolt hole, right at the top. this bung is by the second bolt hole (from the left), about an inch and a half down, maybe 1.25"

that may be an issue? the hose also hangs below the drain right now, but as i thought about it i figured this would not be a big deal... since the oil is always in circulation, there was no danger of it backing up and filling up the whole hose and drowning the turbo? i am not sure if that is the proper reasoning, but thinking of how the circuit works that is what i think of it.

i wasn't sure how to search for this...

the setup is a really fat log manifold, T3/T4 turbo (only oil cooled, no coolant hookups), straight dump towards the ground, internal wastegate, ghetto home depot charge pipe, cheapy air filter... i also have a BOV, TurboXS RFL, to put in, but the ghetto home depot charge pipe has nowhere to put it, so i am making the car driveable then taking it to get a mandrel bent charge pipe set up

summary
- turbo has more shaft play after 1.5 miles then it did before i moved it... it was hot when i checked it after driving, cold when i checked it before
- smoking from turbo, coolant, probably just spilled
- oil pan drain is by second bolt hole from left, 1.25-1.5" inch down, as opposed to 0.5" down by the 3rd bolt hole from left
- car has never seen boost yet, despite the turbo..

What exactly do you need help with? You say the turbo is smoking is all? You see smoke actually coming out of the turbo or is it coming out of the exhaust or somewhere else?

You say the turbo isn't coolant cooled but there is coolant smoking from it??

The placement of the return line should be fine. It's possible that oil is getting coked up in the sagging of the line, how far is it sagging below the bung?

the turbo smoking is no big deal, unless it doesn't go away and it has something to do with the shaft play.. i was more worried about a brand new t3/t4 having shaft play already... the turbo, according to the seller, only had about 1300 miles on it and was perfect when he got it, but now it has shaft play after only being powered on this car for 1.5 miles? that is what worried me more

as well the whole setup has only been driven for about 1.5 miles, this is the first time the car has moved under its own power since the owner took it apart to put the turbo in it, so i don't think oil coking would be an issue. it sags about 2" below though, it is completely underneath the bung... not cool, i'll move it later when i get a permanent dp made, but could this be causing my problems?

Originally posted by tenacious
the turbo smoking is no big deal, unless it doesn't go away and it has something to do with the shaft play.. i was more worried about a brand new t3/t4 having shaft play already... the turbo, according to the seller, only had about 1300 miles on it and was perfect when he got it, but now it has shaft play after only being powered on this car for 1.5 miles? that is what worried me more as well the whole setup has only been driven for about 1.5 miles, this is the first time the car has moved under its own power since the owner took it apart to put the turbo in it, so i don't think oil coking would be an issue. it sags about 2" below though, it is completely underneath the bung... not cool, i'll move it later when i get a permanent dp made, but could this be causing my problems?

Is it a Star turbo kit or did he buy the turbo seperate? Do you know who made the turbo?

It sounds like you're going to have to take the turbo off anyway to replace or rebuild(if the play is as bad as you're making it sound) so just look at it and check for any signs of possible oil starvation, if the return line looks clogged/backed up. Check your oil pressure, too. And you didn't exactly answer this, but are you seeing smoke coming off of the turbo itself? What color is it?

Originally posted by 420a-Tnthewerks

Originally posted by tenacious the turbo smoking is no big deal, unless it doesn't go away and it has something to do with the shaft play.. i was more worried about a brand new t3/t4 having shaft play already... the turbo, according to the seller, only had about 1300 miles on it and was perfect when he got it, but now it has shaft play after only being powered on this car for 1.5 miles? that is what worried me more as well the whole setup has only been driven for about 1.5 miles, this is the first time the car has moved under its own power since the owner took it apart to put the turbo in it, so i don't think oil coking would be an issue. it sags about 2" below though, it is completely underneath the bung... not cool, i'll move it later when i get a permanent dp made, but could this be causing my problems?

Is it a Star turbo kit or did he buy the turbo seperate? Do you know who made the turbo? It sounds like you're going to have to take the turbo off anyway to replace or rebuild(if the play is as bad as you're making it sound) so just look at it and check for any signs of possible oil starvation, if the return line looks clogged/backed up. Check your oil pressure, too. And you didn't exactly answer this, but are you seeing smoke coming off of the turbo itself? What color is it?

its a cobbled together "kit" but he was pretty vague on where the pieces came from... something about a turbo sourced local, a manifold from california, so on ... the manifold looks like the one hahn racecraft uses in their 420A kits, i think that's what this may be

the smoke looks like it is coming off the surface of the turbo, turbine section and center section, its white... (oil smokes blue, right?) only thing i might think odd about it is that it is coming from the center section, maybe it just got into all the ridges it has there.. and the shaft play isn't major, we are talking less then a millimeter back and forth. just, compared to perfect, in 1.5 miles that is a lot... (it looks like something has hit a couple of the blades on the compressor wheel? they have marks on them, but no pieces missing or anything) i checked oil by taking the line off the feed from the turbo, starting the car, and just dumping the oil into the bucket.. it came out pretty hard, when i ran the car for a minute with the drain straight open i got a trickle of it out the bottom like I should, since it should be low pressure by that point, right?

i don't have an oil press. gauge but i will try to find one to check it as soon as I get some time.

as for who made the turbo, I have no idea... the compressor side says "AIR RESEARCH T04" and I believe he said it was a T04B V-trim compressor, there isn't really any markings on the turbine side.

edit: I just remember the guy said he had to use a hammer and WD40 and liquid wrench to clock the turbine section so the center section pointed straight down, that might be why it is smoking so much, the WD40 and liquid wrench are burning off

you know a picture is worth a......

Post some if you want us to better help you.

Originally posted by tenacious
that might be why it is smoking so much, the WD40 and liquid wrench are burning off

Sounds like you have that problem solved.

As far as the play, some play is perfectly normal for turbo's. Your little millimeter movement seems fine, just keep an eye on it to see if it comes progressively worse in a short time. He also may have bought some random shit turbo off Ebay for all we know.

a hammer? :wary

precision LOL

Originally posted by micyek
a hammer? :wary precision LOL

my thoughts exactly!


How much did you pay for this "junky" thing

Originally posted by ScreaminE

Originally posted by micyek a hammer? :wary precision LOL

my thoughts exactly! How much did you pay for this "junky" thing

not much, it was a mechanic's lein...

although sometimes the only way to clock a turbo is to hit it with a hammer... its called a "variable swing press" in that case :D when we clocked my friend's T3/T4 to put onto his shadow we had to hit the turbine section with a variable swing press.

You guys may think i'm a tard, but what the hell is clocking the turbo?

clocking:

A turbo needs oil just like a motor. The center section of a turbo has an oil feed and an oil drain.

Since turbo's are so universal when you take it from one vehicle to another you have the Turn the center section of the turbo so that the feed is pointing straight up and the drain is feeding downward(to the oil pan)

alrighty then, and knowing is half the battle.

Originally posted by knight ryda 99
alrighty then, and knowing is half the battle.

compressor side is easy, but do it last. turbine side is harder. garrett turbos like mine have a bunch of bolts holding on these big rings, loossen up all the bolts and you should be able to rotate the compressor and turbine sides freely, but i guess the turbine side usually gets stuck from being heat cycled so much, so you will probably need to get some penetrating compound on it and club it with a hammer (although like mine, your turbo will look like it is on fire for a good while). use a rubber one haha. hit the turbine side straight down so it drops off the center section, then put it back as you like it. there might be a pin that forces it into alignment, shave that pin off if you so need.

Originally posted by tenacious
when we clocked my friend's T3/T4 to put onto his SHADOW we had to hit the turbine section with a variable swing press.

A Dodge shadow rihgt? I understand that any car built right can do impressive things, but with my personal experience with a dodge shadow (especially it being my first car and the center of all my hate during high school)I just get a bad taste in my mouth reading this.
edit: not a tard :)

I figure since I cant stop fixing the damn thing, I'll just create more problems to work on. :) The stock pile has begun. Parts PArts PARts PARTs PARTS!!!
I'm a novice listen to what I say and make your own conclusion. If I'm wrong tell me and I will learn. Thanks be to the 2gnt Gods may they grant me turbo and fruits of the Earth. Amen.

Originally posted by hs_elrod

Originally posted by tenacious when we clocked my friend's T3/T4 to put onto his SHADOW we had to hit the turbine section with a variable swing press.

A Dodge shadow rihgt? I understand that any car built right can do impressive things, but with my personal experience with a dodge shadow (especially it being my first car and the center of all my hate during high school)I just get a bad taste in my mouth reading this. edit: not a tard :) I figure since I cant stop fixing the damn thing, I'll just create more problems to work on. :) The stock pile has begun. Parts PArts PARts PARTs PARTS!!! I'm a novice listen to what I say and make your own conclusion. If I'm wrong tell me and I will learn. Thanks be to the 2gnt Gods may they grant me turbo and fruits of the Earth. Amen.

i am reasonably sure it was a shadow. it was either that or a shade? maybe a a sprint? or something. we just call it the turbo beater lol.
it looks like a piece of garbage, ugly ugly car, but damn it is quick.

Originally posted by tenacious
i am reasonably sure it was a shadow. it was either that or a shade? maybe a a sprint? or something. we just call it the turbo beater lol. it looks like a piece of garbage, ugly ugly car, but damn it is quick.

scroll done a bit

http://home.earthlink.net/~turbogus/index-old.html

okay this CAN'T be good... took the charge pipe apart today to replace it with a better one... and i find oil in the bottom of the charge pipe. "fuck" I think. then i think i will take apart the compressor just to make sure there is none in there either. but, i take it off, and there is oil pooled in the bottom. "fuck!!" i think again. then I look underneath the car and see the turbo is seeping oil out the bottom. "FUCK!!"
i didn't have time to check for a backed up oil drain line, but i don't think that is the case, the turbo looks like something has been sucked into the compressor blades and has developed some shaft play. what the fuck happened? can i drive it around and boost like this, or is this the kind of thing that needs a rebuild right away?

Hm I wonder what it was and where it went. It's hard to tell whether it's good enough to drive around with, without seeing it. I would definately be looking for a new turbo though, not just to get rid of the bad fins, oil leaking and play(if that's not enough reasons), but just to know what turbo I actually have.

no kidding... there doesn't look to be any fin damage, they just have marks on them, but no pieces are missing and they feel smooth to the touch... the play isn't serious, it is just a little back and forth, but the turbo smokes a lot of oil. it is coming mostly from the center section, it's probably just full of oil (I'm hoping its just full) so I'm going to let it drain today and cut down the drain line so it isn't all loopy like it is right now..

alright I just ran the car again, drove fine... except it bogs every time I go from part throttle to no throttle, kinda sputters and the rpms drop... that might be because of the huge fuel pump, i cannot say... doesn't die, it runs fine, it clears out right away
OH YEAH never mind it might be because i accidently disconnected that EGR thing and forgot to reconnect it, that probably caused it... didn't give me a CEL though?

i also cut the oil return hose down so it is just a straight drop into the pan instead of all the loopy shit it did before, i checked the size to make sure it was bigger then the feed and this hose is huge, like a garden hose almost except made by goodyear haha....

when i got to the car wash, the radiator was smoking the same smoke the turbo did... so i am really hoping it is just something spilled onto this stuff. when i got home, after a hard pull up a hill which involved the zero on my boost gauge taunting me as my car refused to go from vacuum to boost because of a stuck open wastegate, the turbo was smoking again. the smoke went away really fast this time, but i am going to take the filter off and see if there is oil pooled in the compressor again,.

never mind, forgot how to make sense

goto the Junkyard and get a turbo or upgrade it.

AFAIK if there was a backup it the return line there could have been too much pressure in the turbo and it caused the bearing to wear :shrug Some BB turbos run a restrictor in the feed line to limit the high pressure oil.

Originally posted by Blizare
goto the Junkyard and get a turbo or upgrade it. AFAIK if there was a backup it the return line there could have been too much pressure in the turbo and it caused the bearing to wear :shrug Some BB turbos run a restrictor in the feed line to limit the high pressure oil.

hmm i wish it was a ball bearing turbo :D
i found an old post by corbin that says if the return line gets backed up, it may give the appearance of a wrecked turbo because bearing can't hold back the pressure.. since they are meant to withstand a spray of oil as opposed to solid liquid oil? something along those lines. we'll see...
the turbo seems okay now. all the smoking has gone away. i just cleaned up the intake pipe and drove it around for awhile to see if i am still getting oil out the compressor side, i'll let you know what it looks like when the car cools down enough so i can actually touch it ..

good shit. Hopefully it runs good for you now :thumbsup

Originally posted by Blizare
good shit. Hopefully it runs good for you now :thumbsup

even if it doesn't run good, it'll have to do... just listening to the turbo makes this whole thing worthwhile!!