ok story first:

driving home for xmas break down florida turnpike...car feels fine

i dont know when it happened, but a lil over halfway i noticed the oil pressure was low...it wasnt off the bottom of the guage, but it was low

i was about 10-15 miles from a rest area, so i drove it to there

parked the car, went inside to eat...car was on the turbo timer, and sounded fine as i walked away

when i came back to the car, i checked the oil: dipstick was bone dry (was full when i got gas before i left). walked to the back of my car, back of the car is covered in oil

bought a couple quarts of oil, put it in, hoping to see where the leak was...

car wouldnt start...after several attempts, the motor wouldnt even turn over. seems motor seized, im guessing bearings seized from oil starvation.

got it towed home, this morning went to start looking, expecting to find a oil feed line popped off or something

just for kicks, tried to start it again, and it wont start, but the motor is turning over again, so guess its not seized afterall

under the car, cant find where the oil is coming from, but everything under the car and the back of the block is covered in oil

just pulled the IC piping and exhuast off to get more room, but still cant find where the oil is leaking. car is getting spark, and doesnt leak oil when trying to crank it


oh yeah- turbo seems fine, no shaft play and still spins fine.

ideas? where to go from here?

guess im gonna pull the pan next and see if i can see any damage from there :/


edit--
forgot to mention, all other gauges read normal while i was driving, enigne temp, egt, vacuum, a/f all looked good. also, no noticeable loss of power

Easiest way to help diagnosing the problem is find out how high up you see oil. Is there any above the pan (if not, prob is somewhere in the pan)? Is there any on the front of the engine (possibly leaking out at turbo)? Do you have a PCV or catchcan or how is your crankcase ventilated? Mine goes out a tube to the ground. Possibly over time and excessive boost maybe you blew a lot out through there.

Just ideas...there's really not a whole lot of info to go on.

good luck

Matt

update:

got the car started...

had spark, but the fuel pump wasnt coming on, just hard wired the pump, and the car started right up

so, good news #1: motor isnt seized...still dont get why it wouldnt turn over yesterday, but whatever, its turning over now


but bad news, even with the motor started, doesnt seem to be oil leaking anywhere now??


also posted @ asog @ http://bbs.asog.net/viewtopic.php?t=37922

>Easiest way to help diagnosing the problem is find out how
>high up you see oil. Is there any above the pan (if not,
>prob is somewhere in the pan)? Is there any on the front of
>the engine (possibly leaking out at turbo)? Do you have a
>PCV or catchcan or how is your crankcase ventilated? Mine
>goes out a tube to the ground. Possibly over time and
>excessive boost maybe you blew a lot out through there.
>
>Just ideas...there's really not a whole lot of info to go
>on.
>
>good luck
>
>Matt


like i said in the original post, back of the block is covered in oil

cant be a slw leak over time, b/c like i said, started the trip, oil is fine... 2 hrs later, no oil

i have the crankcase ventilated the same way you do, tube going to the ground

you could have sliced your turbo's feed line. i did that once, and it wouldn't leak unless you got some pressure in it, and it would spray out of the line off the back of the block and get oil EVERYWHERE..

then there was the time when the drain from the turbo came off... OOOPS. lol

then maybe cracked oil pan, blown oil pan gasket, or like ^^^ said, cut oil feed/return line.

Headgasket???

update:

like i said, car is running now...

however, i never found exactly where oil leaked from

BUT, along w/ a leaking water pump (dont think its related, ive been losing antifreeze for a while now), there is now smoke coming from the valve cover breathers and when i pull the oil dipstick out, smoke coming from there

headgasket? rings?

Shut the car off and look for bubbling coolant = HG
The smoke coming out of the dipstick is a good indication of rings. Do a comp test and see what's up to just to be sure.

sounds to me like you blew the head gasket, or did some piston damage..white smoke from the oil dipstick means pressure is getting by one or two things...either the headgasket is blown causeing pressure to escape through the oil passages, or you cracked a piston ring landing, causing pressure to get by the piston.. I got mad blowby out my dipstick tube when i cracked my #4 piston ring lands...If you were running with very low oil, you could have also done damage to the piston/and or rings, causing blowby and bad compression..do a compression test first. Oil on the back of the block most likely came from the headgasket..its really hard to say if the motor was overheated..could be many things..

So, is there any way for me to determine if its rings/ringlands versus a headgasket, short of tearing down the engine?

or is the only way to take it somewhere for a leakdown test?


btw, thanx for all the replies so far...sux that i have to post this tho, but nice be able to get plenty of help when you need it

The only real way to tell for sure is to tear it apart. On my 95 when I tore it apart, I had a leaky headgasket, a broken ring land, and 2 other pistons with hairline cracks on the upper ring lands. Its funny how the car was still running fine when I tore it apart with all of that messed up. Since you have a 95, I'd say that the probablility of you having a blown headgasket is very high since they did not use the MLS gasket until later on. What I would do if I were you would be to take it all apart and check the pistons over very closely (tough to see cracks on the ring lands sometimes). If they are all fine, then replace the headgasket and throw it back together. If you have a broken piston(s) and dont want to spend the $ on forged internals, then find someone here with an old spare stock piston on the board, re-hone the cylinder it goes in, and drop that in. Otherwise, if you have the money, now is a very good time to rebuild since it will be apart anyway.

ok, drove the car to the parts store and picked up a compression gauge

1st, driving: other than the smoke coming from the vave cover breather lines, the car seemed to drive fine...car idled a little rough, but my car idle has always been kinda rough...the difference is minimal but enough for me to notice.

all gauges read ok. no loss in vacuum, egts look fine, a/f good. oil pressure looked fine, and even w/ just one fan(took one off to make r&r of the hahn dp easier), car never even showed signs of overheating

car drove fine, no bucking, no hesitation, went into boost fine. i had converted back to stage 1, and was seeing boost 2600-3000rpms in first. havent driven the car in stage 1 in a long time, but didnt seem to be any loss in power.

again, no signs of oil leak


anywho, got the compression gauge, went to pop the hood, and there is some oil now up front, where i had relocated the valve cover breather lines: so they ARE the source of the oil leak.

compression results:

#1-205
#2-205
#3-90 :(
#4-200

so, looks like #3 piston is toast...

if it was the headgasket, all cylinders or none would show something, right? plus no other of the usual signs of a blown headgasket


---edit---
forgot to ask this:

im back home for the xmas break...school starts jan 6 back up in gainesville (~4 hr drive)

obviously, dont have enough time to have a rebuild done down here: is the car driveable in this state?

like i said, the car honestly drives fine, but it does have blow-by...so if i stay out of boost to keep blow-by to a minimum, keep an eye on the oil (like stop at every or every other rest stop and top it off), will i be able to make it back up there so i can i can rebuild the motor up there?

Stock motor? Looks like #3 has a cracked ring landing. This happens so often on the stock pistons. It's driveable but it'll just eat at your cylinder and get worse and then won't run at all plus you might be shopping for a new block.

>Stock motor? Looks like #3 has a cracked ring landing.
>This happens so often on the stock pistons. It's driveable
>but it'll just eat at your cylinder and get worse and then
>won't run at all plus you might be shopping for a new block.

yea, been stock for the 14-15months ive been boosting... i guess i did alright, considering the engine lasted longer than a lot of poeples do, plus i run more boost than most (10-12psi daily on a stock motor)

ill be more than likely getting a built shortblock, so the conidtion of the cylinder wall isnt to much of a concern. the problem is school starts jan 6th, and im 4 hrs away. so i obviously dont have the time (or $$) to do a rebuild right now.. prolly gonna swap in a used stock piston to hold me over till summer when ill have time to do it right. but i need a means of transportation to get me back up to gainesville