Here's the situation - my power door locks quit working several months ago. The motors are good, the switches work, the relay in the dash is new. If i pull the relay or yank the power door lock fuse and lock the door, they will unlock when i plug it back in, but they won't lock with the switches.

If the motor is good, the relay is good, and the switch is good, what the hell else is there that could be the culprit? Someone has to know. I know there are guys here that install alarms, power lock kits, ect.. any ideas guys?

I'll buy you a freakin case of beer if you can help me figure this out.

Don't know much about it, but does it even make some sort of noise or effort when you try to lock it? Maybe the mechanism is getting caught on something when it tries to pull in the lock direction.

That's a thought, but on both locks at the same time?

When i check with a multimeter, the 12v+ signal for the motor does not change - i don't think it's getting any signal change at all then the buttons are pushed.

>>>>If i pull the relay or yank the power door lock fuse and lock the door, they will unlock when i plug it back in, but they won't lock with the switches.

Clarify -> So you are saying that when you pull out the fuse, and put the fuse back in, the doors will power unlock just once? Or do they always power unlock, and power lock is just messed up.

The key to all this is that both passenger and driver locks went out at the same time. So I agree that it is very unlikely to be both locks, both relays, or something catching on both doors. What can go out and take out both doors at the same time -> the switch. Possibly the wires leading to the switch from the power supply, instead of from it to both doors. You say the switch is working, how have you determined that? Can you check the current around that switch w/ it pushed in and pushed out? See if there is a difference. If there is none, that's the culprit.

I can't think of anything else that would take out both doors at once. you're getting a voltage at both locks so it can't be a short

in that case are you sure that the switches are working?

I get continuity through the switch in both lock and unlock positions. I get 12v+ at the motor, and continuity to ground. If i somehow break the circuit (yank fuse, relay, unplug the motor) and manually LOCK both the doors, when the circuit is completed, it will automagically unlock the doors - once. So this leads me to beleive that aside from the fact it isn't working, the system is fully functional.

I have also removed, disassembled and cleaned the motors, and they made enough torque to spit the step-down gears out of the case when i tested them. The linkages are fine and unbound on both doors. All the fuses and relays are good.

One day they just stopped, both, at the same time. Someone has to know why, so i don't have to pay the stealership $60 an hour to tell me.

Try reading my post if it helps you...???just throwing that out there
http://www.2gnt.com/dcforum/DCForumID25/5694.html
EDIT: I forgot you arleady posted in it lol ;)


1999 Mitsubishi Eclipse GS 10th Anniversary OZ Edition
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Okay, if I understand you correctly, I'm pretty sure it's the switch. If by "continuity", you mean that there is current or voltage always going throught the switch whether it's on or off, then that seems wrong. (I actually was hoping you would press the switch on and off while the ampmeter was attached and looked for fluctuations b/c that would give me the info I was looking for.)

Follow my thinking - in normal circumstances, when you flip the switch between on and off, there is a disruption of the voltage/current, and the locks will move. The switch isn't functioning so there is no disruption of the circuit. But when you do something to disrupt the circuit, such as removing a fuse, a motor, or anything else in the circuit, and then reattach that component to make the circuit complete again - you've in fact made an artificial switch, and the door unlocks, but just once b/c you have to disrupt the circuit again to unlock the doors.

If you can, take apart that switch. See if something looks irregular

You aren't listening. I have said at least twice now the switch is fine. I already tried that route. I get continuity (as in, current will flow through the switch in the lock and unlock positions, and not in at at-rest position, just like it should.) on the right pins in the right positions when i tested it with my multimeter.

And, if it were the switch, i could still use the passenger side switch to get that door to unlock. That doesn't work either.

This is why i'm so tired of this problem - everything says it shoulf be working. Everything gets voltage, everything functions when i test it off the car. it's frustrating.

dayam, alright I didn't know that "continuity" referred to no current @ off and current @ on.

Here is a trick I used to fix eledtrical probs....... first, the day it stoped workin, do you remember what you did to your car befor? You may have a lose ground...... that would explane y that you get power from the switch...... but I dont have power windows. Mine work by makeing curcular motions with my arms

Dino,
Do you have an aftermarket alarm? If so, did the doors lock/unlock when ever you armed/disarmed the system? If it was like that get to the alarm brain and remove the 2 wires that are tapped into the door lock wires. Once removed try the switches and see if they work now.

I do have an aftermarket alarm, and i did find the two wires from the brain to the door lock wires. I unplugged the socket for those two wires from the brain and tried the locks and still no go. i didn't try to totally remove the wires, nor did I unhook them from the door lock wires - just unplugged that set from the brain. I also removed power to the brain itself to see if perhaps my alarm was interfering, but again no go.

Good idea, though. keep 'em coming.

The only thing that i can think of that might have anything to do with it is my valet switch - it wires come unsoldered from the switch itself. That just means i can't put it into valet mode, tho - does anyone think this could be the culprit? i can't see any signal going through a normally-broken circuit, however.

Yeah, something like that is happening to my car too..
The locks are pretty lazy, like when I hit the lock/unlock switch, it sometimes goes all the way, sometimes the lock stops half way..

Its pretty wierd, I think I may need to lube it up, any other ideas?

Thanks

Dino,
i know that both sides of switch banks (passanger lock switch, and driver lock switch) must be completely plugged in, in order for the door locks to work. when you actuate either lock switch do you hear the switch unit behind the radio clicking? what I would recommend to do is to see if you have continuity through the wires from the door lock switches to the switch module behind the radio. just to make sure that you do not have any broken wires inline, and if that is good then maybe check if the plugs are making contact. at each switch assembly.
man if that is all good then i don't know what else it could be?
lates
james

The dash relay is fully functional, it does click when i press the buttons. initially, i thought it was the culprit as it was the only thing i heard when the locks quit. It's a $35 relay, so i bought a new one - no go.

I'm going to try a few things this evening and see what i can see - fix the valet switch, totally disconnect the alarm from the power lock system, etc.

Lets see if i can shed some light here. The door lock switches in the door use a negative pulse to activate the relays. Pull the switches and use a voltmeter, set it to continuity, put one lead of the meter to a good ground, the other on one of the switch wires, there should be 3 there. One wire is the lock, one is unlock, and one is the negative feed for the switch. Find that negative feed wire, and see if you have a good ground at that wire. You should. If not, then you'll have to trace the wiring, it may have a break some where, esp in the door boot part. If you have continuity, then next check the relays, and the relay sockets. Look at the back of the relay and find pin# 85 and 86. One of those pins is the lock wire, or unlock wire, wichever relay you got in hand, the other pin will have +12 volts on it. So either pin 85 or 86 will be 12 volts, or it will be or 85 or 86 will be the lock/unlock wire. If you find no +12 volts to either of those pins, then you need to check the power feed to the relays. Now if you got power there, now check either pin# 30, or #87 for +12 volts. If no, then the power feed for that needs to be found and checked. Repeat this for the other relay. Also, see if the relays themselves are clicking when you hit the door switch, that will tell you if the relays are working properly,or if you are missing some power to it somewhere. This is a start, hope this helps..

EDit: saw that the relays do click, so def check to see if you have +12 volts at either pin# 30, or 87. Check BOTH relay sockets, then get back to me..

Bitchin. You kick ass. I'll give that a shot next, and let you know how it goes!

So there are two relays, one for lock and one for unlock? I didn't know that. Only one clicks, in that case - the lock relay - but they don't lock. I really need to get some time and go after those relays with my multimeter. it's a nice Fluke piece, so it's such a shame i don't use it more often...

After testing the driver's side switch: i get one solid ground, and one "diode good" single beep.

+++++
=OO-+

where + is a non-ground terminal, - is a solid ground, = is the "good diode" single beep ground, and O is not part of the plug but the ascii won't line up without it ;-)

Relays tomorrow, possibly..

Right there are 2 relays, one for lock one for unlock, but BOTH need to be fully operative for the locks to work, because signals from one go through the other, its hard to explain. But at the drivers switch, you should get a solid ground, which looks like you did, and then when you hit lock, your meter should beep on one wire, and when you hit unlock it should beep on the left over wire. Get at the relays and go from there. Also, there should be no +12 volts at the switches..If there is, then most likely its a bad relay coil..

The wires at the switch and relay:

Lock is a RED/BLUE wire
Unlock is a BROWN/RED wire Both are negative pulses to activate the factory relays..

I'll have to go back and check.. i got 12v+ somewhere on that plug, but it's also got the power windows, and window lock switch on it, too, so it may not be a steady 12v+ for the locks. Man, there should be more hours in the day for this crap..