95 eagle talon esi I am running about 160hp at the flywheel, I have a unorthodox underdrive pulley, 2.25in maganflo cat-back, bosh plugs and wires, ams oil 0w30 oil
ceneterforce clutch and flywheel, on the way I have a dc sports 4-2-1 header, and ingen rd cai, and iluminas lowering suspension, i also am running a 16in rota gt3 wheel with a cooper zeon 2xs..very good tire..lightweel, the car runs very good, i dont have the money to turbo right now and proally wont for a while (im still in highschool) i was looking at the aem cam gears, and a highflo catback..mabye a ecu upgrade...very new to ecu upgrading..who makes a good one for our cars?

no "good" ecu upgrades for 95.

Next big power adder for n/a is cams. It gets pretty costly to add some beefy cams, but you can get some less aggressive cams and not have to worry about upgrading your springs. Head work would add a little, but our heads seem to flow well while n/a and even lightly boosted. I would say to get some Crower turbo 2's. They work well while n/a and will also work well when turbo'd. Just keep in mind that while n/a your car will be slow. So save up and happy boosting :thumbsup

Where do you live Keith, this will determine how far you can go with mods as some states are more strict than others. If you live in CA like me then everything needs to go back to stock in a day (or look stock) so you can get by the smog patrol. Cams and cam gears are a nice, hideable mod;
http://forums.2gnt.com/dcboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=32&topic_id=91&mesg_id=91&page=
this is a good place to start learning about that. For any decent power increase from an ECU, your going to have to go with a stand-alone, I would insert a shameless plug for the MegaSquirt here, but if your new to tuning then no one should point you that direction yet. Don't get the S-AFC or a Venom unit, the S-AFC has some negative side effects (advances timing) and the Venom unit doesn't work at WOT, which is where you'll be if you're looking for power increasing mods.
You could start considering some porting work, $145 for a 55mm throttle body from insert random business name here and you could take your intake to a local machine shop (or research it and port it your self) to hog out some aluminum and create some space for flow. This type of stuff needs to be researched first as the more you port, the more you'll lose off the bottom-end (generally).
The only real place to go from there is a rebuilt engine or a power adder, and we all know the cheapest of the three (and the easiest to mess up) is Nitrous (don't let anyone try to convince you to go to a supercharger, it's not worth it for where you are right now). Just do a bunch of reading, you'll find your way.

Why keep throwing money into your N/A trying to get it too fast?

By the time you fork in the cash for some cams, nitrous, port work, etc, your half way to a turbo kit.

Just keep saving until you have enough $$$ for a turbo kit, its better to be slower for the next 6 months or however long it will take you save until you can turbo, its all worth it in the end.

Boost is great. Go take yourself in a ride that turbo'd, you will quit spending money into your n/a and start saving for a kit.

Like ^^^^^^ said, Happy Boosting :)

Originally posted by eclipse982nrRST
Why keep throwing money into your N/A trying to get it too fast? By the time you fork in the cash for some cams, nitrous, port work, etc, your half way to a turbo kit. Just keep saving until you have enough $$$ for a turbo kit, its better to be slower for the next 6 months or however long it will take you save until you can turbo, its all worth it in the end. Boost is great. Go take yourself in a ride that turbo'd, you will quit spending money into your n/a and start saving for a kit. Like ^^^^^^ said, Happy Boosting :)

LOL with all the problems you post about you should not be the spokesman for boost.

Though, that is where my moneys going shortly :P . I'm tired of bolting on the lame and getting jollys' for half a second till I relize its still slow. Also tired of a car that has no issues to keep me busy, so I'll kill 2 birds with one stone.

Originally posted by talon749
95 eagle talon esi I am running about 160hp at the flywheel, I have a unorthodox underdrive pulley, 2.25in maganflo cat-back, bosh plugs and wires, ams oil 0w30 oil ceneterforce clutch and flywheel, on the way I have a dc sports 4-2-1 header, and ingen rd cai, and iluminas lowering suspension, i also am running a 16in rota gt3 wheel with a cooper zeon 2xs..very good tire..lightweel, the car runs very good, i dont have the money to turbo right now and proally wont for a while (im still in highschool) i was looking at the aem cam gears, and a highflo catback..mabye a ecu upgrade...very new to ecu upgrading..who makes a good one for our cars?

not to be an ass, but how do you figure your car having 160hp at the flywheel? a udp and 2.25 catback wont produce 20hp and i dont think a flywheel really helps with adding hp since they are mainly used for acceleration purposes. again, im not trying to be an ass, just trying to figure out where you came up with that number from. as far as your question is concerned, i would say to go with the afx ecu if you want to upgrade your ecu. you can buy it at www.howellautomotive.com for a couple hundred bucks. its the only viable option for an ecu with our cars.

Originally posted by injendsm

Originally posted by talon749 95 I am running about 160hp at the flywheel, I have a unorthodox underdrive pulley, 2.25in maganflo cat-back, bosh plugs and wires, ams oil 0w30 oil ceneterforce clutch and flywheel

not to be an ass, but how do you figure your car having 160hp at the flywheel?

Geez, Greg. It's obvious he pulled the engine out after he installed the UDP, cat back, mad-tyte Platinum plugs, and Marvel Mystery Oil, strapped it to an engine dyno and they gave him a slip showing "about 160hp." It might be 159.2, but that's about 160 imo.

In other words, I was wondering the same thing myself.

You spent too much on the DC header. You spent too much on the Injen intake (imo). Name brand intake and exhaust are foolish for anyone with turbo plans. There is no ECU upgrade to be done or for sale unless you run a 97 MTX. If you have a "maganflo" catback, why are you also planning on buying a high-flow cat back?

I'd say something about the kid with all the problems advising turbo being the way to go, but considering I'm the all motor guy with all the problems, I'll just leave it to a subtle jeering like so. :P

And don't sweat all the people who tell you that it's pointless to build on your engine and to "just boost it." Guess what, if you want to be a serious player and be faster than a stock turbo car, you're going to need to get into that engine one day.

Originally posted by DR1665

Originally posted by injendsm

Originally posted by talon749 95 I am running about 160hp at the flywheel, I have a unorthodox underdrive pulley, 2.25in maganflo cat-back, bosh plugs and wires, ams oil 0w30 oil ceneterforce clutch and flywheel

not to be an ass, but how do you figure your car having 160hp at the flywheel?

Geez, Greg. It's obvious he pulled the engine out after he installed the UDP, cat back, mad-tyte Platinum plugs, and Marvel Mystery Oil, strapped it to an engine dyno and they gave him a slip showing "about 160hp." It might be 159.2, but that's about 160 imo. In other words, I was wondering the same thing myself. You spent too much on the DC header. You spent too much on the Injen intake (imo). Name brand intake and exhaust are foolish for anyone with turbo plans. There is no ECU upgrade to be done or for sale unless you run a 97 MTX. If you have a "maganflo" catback, why are you also planning on buying a high-flow cat back? I'd say something about the kid with all the problems advising turbo being the way to go, but considering I'm the all motor guy with all the problems, I'll just leave it to a subtle jeering like so. :P And don't sweat all the people who tell you that it's pointless to build on your engine and to "just boost it." Guess what, if you want to be a serious player and be faster than a stock turbo car, you're going to need to get into that engine one day.

lol nice. but brian, you and i both know he didnt waste money on that Injen intake haha. i should be their spokesperson.

Two words: Extrude Hone.

Originally posted by ForceFed
Two words: Extrude Hone.

Two more words: Too Expensive

Originally posted by WIDECLIPSE

Originally posted by ForceFed Two words: Extrude Hone.

Two more words: Too Expensive

I would say that having an Extrude Honed intake manifold could be a good thing for a highly modified, NA-trim car (or one being actively campaigned at the track by a skilled driver), but up until that point it's not a requirement. There are other, more down-to-earth modifications that could be done first.

Don't forget, guys, this is a 2nd Gen Non Turbo website. Don't knock those who would pursue a different path than you. :thumbsup

N/A has advantages, we just need to unlock our engines hidden power, if a honda can make 250whp N/A, so can we. I think it's hidden in the computer!

It's the VVEEEEETECH man!!

Originally posted by Keith2172
N/A has advantages, we just need to unlock our engines hidden power, if a honda can make 250whp N/A, so can we. I think it's hidden in the computer!

our car is not a honda, its a chrysler engine stuffed into a mitsubishi body. the highest an n/a 2gnt has gotten to date is 160whp i believe. i dont see us getting 90whp from the computer but i guess thats just me.

Turbo.

Originally posted by injendsm

Originally posted by Keith2172 N/A has advantages, we just need to unlock our engines hidden power, if a honda can make 250whp N/A, so can we. I think it's hidden in the computer!

our car is not a honda, its a chrysler engine stuffed into a mitsubishi body. the highest an n/a 2gnt has gotten to date is 160whp i believe. i dont see us getting 90whp from the computer but i guess thats just me.

160whp? I though we had guys running higher than that! Still, an engine is an engine, and 2.0 liters is 2.0 liters. Whats a 200whp a Honda engine have that we don't (besides VTEC, that aint worth 50hp)? The secret to making horsepower doesn't lay in a brand, it lays in port shape, airflow, fuel supply, etc. If you can flow enough air and supply enough fuel, then set off the spark at the right time, you should have no problem (Im over simplifying this but seriously)
When I get the time and money to complete my MS install I'll dyno it and we'll see what an almost completely stock engine can do with fuel control (I've got a header and ported TB)

Originally posted by Keith2172
an engine is an engine, and 2.0 liters is 2.0 liters. Whats a 200whp a Honda engine have that we don't (besides VTEC, that aint worth 50hp)? The secret to making horsepower doesn't lay in a brand, it lays in port shape, airflow, fuel supply, etc.

This is correct, but you underestimate what VTEC actually does. Basically, if you wanted to push the limits of whp on a NA DSM, you're going to need to be running some very aggressive cams (like a Crower3). The problem you would encounter with a 420A running wicked cams like that is that they make dick for power down low. Your power band isn't going to start until above 3000-3500rpm. How would that be for daily driving? It would suck. This is where the dual cam profiles used by VTEC come into play. They allow the Honda engine to provide decent power for daily driving, but switch over to a more aggressive profile under load. If they couldn't "hot swap" cam profiles on the fly with VTEC, they'd be in the same boat we're in.

There is a reason why no one has crossed the 200whp barrier NA on a 2GNT yet: it makes for a decent race car, but not a decent daily driver. You have to build to your goals.

Tuning (as with MS) is going to be paramount, however it's going to be very expensive to get to the point where you can set your sights on breaking any records. Speaking for myself, I've got about $6k wrapped up under my hood and I'm hoping to break 180whp. Then, it's 14.999ETs. Then, it's turbo time. :7