I've always wondered how do able it is.

I saw someone posting an ebay link for electric power steering pump http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=33588&item=2430582986 aswell as I know of a company that makes universal elec. power steering pump for utility vehicles. Since it'd be an electric pump, the psi/pressure level should be adjustable to make the steering wheel stiff/lose.

http://www.sanden.com/products/electric.html <<<this company makes electric a/c compressors for automotive applications. Now granted its probably gonna be an expensive Item, but just for discussion's sake, It'll pay off by all the money saved in gas.

Or the other possibility for it could be to mount an electric motor and use it to run the a/c compressor. Maybe mount the motor where P.S pump would be, use a way smaller belt, and use the stock acc. tensioner.

Ofcourse then we'd need a stronger alternator.

and we could use tti racing pulley to drive just the alternator. (more hp)

I'm interested to hear your thoughts.

Ya, that was me that posted that link. I think if we could relocate this stuff, we could have SOOO MUCH MORE ROOM! it was for that guy with the huge blower.... he's gonna need this i bet.

Actually, an electric A/C compressor would load the crank more then a belt driven A/C compressor. The higher the load on the alternator, the more rotational resistance it provides. An electric accessory is less effecient then a belt driven one, because of generator losses, losses in the harness, and losses in converting the electrical energy back into kinetic energy. The advantages would be: more space, simpler belt scheme, elimination of that goddamned tensioner, and the ability to turn either off at whatever parameters you choose (WOT could turn off the AC, the PS pump could be wheel speed sensitive, not engine speed sensitive, etc.). You would actually get worse gas milage from running an electric set of accessories then you would a mechanical set of accessories. Which sounds more efficient? Kinetic energy to work, or kinetic energy to electrical energy to kinetic energy to work? Of course, the one with less steps. ;)
-=B-=

hrm... maybe for people that don't use ac much... i'd just leave it off until i wanted it. saving there. and power steering, what you make up from not having ac might make it the same as stock? then when you race, turn off the ps cuz your going in a straight freakin line. plus all the pros you had ^.

EDIT: this is all under the assumtion you could make it all work right.

lets keep this going i plan on doing the electric power steering...

a/c well im not sure doubtful....

Bill

>The higher the load on
>the alternator, the more rotational resistance it provides.

Really? That's cool, good to know. Now I know why I hear old skool drag racers joking that they shoulda turned off the headlights.

I guess I should turn off the a/c when drag racing now too huh?

As far as "adjustable" power steering, I don't think that's possible with an electric motor. Think about it, does your car turn differently at 1000 rpm vs. 8000rpm? There's something like a little proportioning valve in there that makes the pressure to the steering rack constant. You'd have to mod that if you want adjustable steering ratios... And that's independant of it being electrical or belt driven.

Bill is right. You would actually be loosing more power than you free up. The more power your alternator needs to generate the harder it becomes to turn. Notice how many drag cars dont have alts, they have 2 poles mounted on the body to charge the battery before a run. If it was more efficent to run acc's off electrical current the automakers would have beat you to it.

My advice - Hamster wheel.

I understand what you are saying about it taking more energy going from mechanical->electric->mechanical, but couldn't you just make the electric power steering use energy only when turning - like on the BMW z4? That power steering is completely off as you go straight down a freeway - aka no drain on the alternator. This would actually conserve gas and engine power on the freeway (the reason BMW did this). However, in city driving, the electric system would not be as efficient as the belt driven one.

As long as you race in a straight line, it should be better for both power and mileage. If you race in a zig zag - you're probably better off with the stock system ;)

I wouldn't adjust the steering ratio, I would adjust the power assist, giving more help at slow speeds, and little or no help at highway speeds. It also wouldn't be pumping while the steering wheel isn't being turned. It will save overall power and increase overall fuel effeciency, but on an autocross, power and fuel effeciency would be down slightly. Very slightly.
-=B-=

my 350z has light PS that uses less drive train power and increases your ability to feel the road. If we could somehow do that on our cars it would be perfect. Its one of my favorite things about the Z, that and the adjustible shift light heheh.

so far we know of a subaru xt6 steering pump any other suggestions...

after talking with the1bill tapping the powersteering pump into the speed sensor would probably be best..

Bill

This is another electric pump that I found.
http://peerlesselectric.com/pump.htm

i did some reading on xt6. xt6 power steering system consists of electro-hydrolic steering pump and a control unit which taps into the speed sensor.

As far as I can understand you can use the pump directly and it should work but it won't be speed sensitive. If we could some how use that control unit and make it work in our car we'll be able to get stiffer steering in high speed and lose in city driving.

also according to this website. the new mini uses an electric pump aswell...

http://www.zf-group.co.uk/news/news_archive/news_archive_steeringinmini.htm

1988 fiero had it aswell
http://www.michiganfieroclub.org/psteering.htm

european site but doesn't hurt.
http://www.vetus.nl/producten/product_main_31_2.asp

Mind you, if I was to use the XT setup, I would include the ECU. :D I'll let you know how it works out once my car is, uh, well, running.
-=B-=

SWEET! ^^^^^^^. I am glad i posted about that pump!!!!! Maybe you could get that guy who made that "force open loop" guy to jerryt rig sumthin up to get the speed crap fixed. who was that? ner somethin?

EDIT: btw, shouldn't this go into advanced tuning?

it was it got moved :rolleyes

hrm now i gotta find one of these pumps...

Bill

if all you want is road feel dino posted some powre steering mod awhile back that would reduce the pressure the pump put out. i guess you could also use a different pulley on it or something.

the idea is to remove the draw or restriction from the motor when not needed...

i only need power steering when parallel parking hence why i removed it till i figure out the electric route...

Bill

Originally posted by MotoFool
the idea is to remove the draw or restriction from the motor when not needed... i only need power steering when parallel parking hence why i removed it till i figure out the electric route... Bill

Hmmm make it a electric clutch system like the ac compressor.... Junkyard hybrid build :thumbsup ..you could have it disengage clutch when over 2krpm or togle switched

Originally posted by Eclipse97
also according to this website. the new mini uses an electric pump aswell...

And since the Mini has a variant of the 420A, sounds like a good way to go.



http://www.exileracing.com
una salus victus
Mods List: http://highlander.dsmpower.com/sig.htm

Why not just switch to a real full manual rack..

Didn't the 1.8L 1989 talon/eclipse come with one of those? sure it's more turns lock to lock.. but big deal.

Why make it harder than it has to be..

-- WheatKing

I didn't know of any full manual racks out there. deffinately a way to go.



http://www.exileracing.com
una salus victus
Mods List: http://highlander.dsmpower.com/sig.htm

nooo manualll!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


or just do both. and no it won't be a clutch. just switch the pump on and off. you don't need to turn when your going straight. its an instant hp gain.

exactly...your ac does not drain as much hp(it might minimally cause of pully drag..thats it) when its disengaged

thereby my sugestion of an ac compresor clutch sort of system engaging the PS....i mean they both pumps...how hard would it to find an ac pump one could addapt its clutch to our ps system (verry hard??):thumbsup

uhm. i'd rather rely on a toggle switch than dealing with a clutch imo...

Originally posted by BlueMoonEclipse
exactly...your ac does not drain as much hp(it might minimally cause of pully drag..thats it) when its disengaged thereby my sugestion of an ac compresor clutch sort of system engaging the PS....i mean they both pumps...how hard would it to find an ac pump one could addapt its clutch to our ps system (verry hard??):thumbsup

I love this idea!


Nick
97RS

turbo8u> shut your SUCK
ZAO684: NIPPLE warning...maybe>?