^#&%&(^$&^#$$(%^$(^*( Baaaaaaaahhhh!!!!

So.... I get the car put back together yesterday, I let everything sit and all the gasket sealers cure (copper spray on HG and RTV on crankscraper). Also installed Accell 30lb injectors (from HRC).

I go home at lunch today to turn her over. She cranks, kind of catches and dies. I try the key again and there's not enough juce to turn the starter that fast (aftr a few seconds it starts cranking slower). So I put the charger on the battery and go make myself food.

Come back out and try again. nothing... nothing... nothing, just turns and after maybe 10 to 15 seconds juice is out of the battery and needs more charging. So I do the cycle again (two times). Then pull the Neon up and get a set of Jumper cables on it. Try startign it... nothing. It seems like it's going to catch a couple of times, but nothing.

I'll need to double check all my connections: vacuum lines, sensors etc. Check my cam timing. I made a minor cam gear adjustment (couple of degrees, to compensate for milling)

The engine ran with the ported/polished head on a thinner .027" copper head gasket, which didn't seal. But now with the stock HG it won't turn over.

Differences are the addition of a crankscraper and 30 lb injectors. Could I have flooded it? Could the battery be that shot that with charging and jumpered to the Neon it won't have enough juice to turn over? The compresion is slightly lower, but still greater than stock...

Getting annoyed and now embarassed... suggestions (aside from drnik a few beers for frustration).



15.9 @ 86.7mph

Injen CAI, 55mm TB, P&P Intake, Crower Cams, Hooker Header, ERT/Catco Cat, GS-T Muffler, AFX UDP, Crane Ign Amp, S-AFC

mine does that too at times...with just crank its ass off and not start....after replacing everything..i think its the ignition relay that is crap....maybe a place to start for you too?

I'm feeling like it's something unhooked, like a MAP sensor perhaps, or another important sensor...cam angle perhaps.

I'd give those a look. Most likely, it's something that's insignificant that's holding you up.

You're almost done! :thumbsup

That's my hope, I'm actually hoping to feel extremely stupid when I come across something soo simple. MAP is plugged in and geting signal vacuum goes up when I start cranking the motor on my S-AFC. I checked real quick my O2 connection, IAT, and few quick visual checks on the connectors on the front wiring harness. I can almost remember plugging in the cam angle sensor, but didn't check it.

Anybody else feel it possible that I flooded the engine with the bigger injectors? Or think the battery could be that gone? Possibility of tripping the ASD???

I'll give the ignition relay a look when I start checking stuff (or just get somebody to turn the key and watch my ignition amp light.



15.9 @ 86.7mph

Injen CAI, 55mm TB, P&P Intake, Crower Cams, Hooker Header, ERT/Catco Cat, GS-T Muffler, AFX UDP, Crane Ign Amp, S-AFC

probably flooded.

Pull the fuel pump relay and crank it over a few times to dry it out.

hehehe, no need to pull the relay, I've waired in a fuel pump kill, keyed switch (my antitheft device), when I did the fuel pump mod. I'll try that and see what happens. Hopefully that's it, or something else simple.



15.9 @ 86.7mph

Injen CAI, 55mm TB, P&P Intake, Crower Cams, Hooker Header, ERT/Catco Cat, GS-T Muffler, AFX UDP, Crane Ign Amp, S-AFC

With the 30 lbers, you need to run much lower idle fuel pressure, like around 20-22 psi, so if you are still running the stock FPR, you are dumping waayy to much fuel in there at idle. Dont know what your're setup is now, but just a thought..

I was hoping to compensate with the S-AFC... people have said they've done it. I was going to wait to do the whole fuel ssytem but then the first attempt with the copper gasket failed so I thought I'd try. Sounding more and more like the problem



15.9 @ 86.7mph

Injen CAI, 55mm TB, P&P Intake, Crower Cams, Hooker Header, ERT/Catco Cat, GS-T Muffler, AFX UDP, Crane Ign Amp, S-AFC

I had a similar symptom when i rebuilt my engine....ended up being my cams being out of phase i.e. intake cam was not facing the right direction when i put the timing belt on. Pissed me off hehe

But yeah it just cranked, cranked, cranked but no fire (good ignition and fuel)
_________________
Vinnie Lima
vinnie.lima@jvllogistics.com
AIM: Kiku888
1997 Chrysler Sebring "Silver XTC"
I4 420a w/ HRC Stage 2.45 w/ FMIC
14.7@97 mph@6psi
Proud member of the
ASOG BoOsT JuNkIe Crew

I had this same problem over the weekend putting on new adjuable cam gears. Double check your timing marks. if you compensated with a couple of degrees of adjustment. Put the cams back to the settings you had before the work done and try that. You may have over compensated the timing. As for the fuel i have no idea, i have not gotten that far on my upgrades.

With as much overlap as the cams have a couple degrees shouldn't effect it to the point where it wouldn't even catch. But it's worth some playing. I still need to give a close inspection of all connections.

I'm pretty convinced my bettery is toast. I turned the fuel pump off, and cranked it for a few second to clear and flooding. Turned the pump back on and cranked it again, after a total of maybe 8 to 10 seconds the battery didn't have the juice to crank it over fast. I know the starter has to work harder against the high compression, but it's not that high. I think I'll just bit the bullet and but an Optima, I need a deep cycle because of how often I drive it.

I think 56psi (or whatever stock Fuel pressure is) and low vacuum due to the ported/polished head I just can't compensate with an S-AFC on the 30lb injectors. Guess I'll have to do it the right way after all :P (Aeromotive FPR, and redo my fuel system). How soon depend on what I see in my tuning... once it's running that is.

It's a good thing I'm stubborn, and a great thing I have the Neon as a daily driver...

Now it's time for me to get more fuel... to the coffee machine!



15.9 @ 86.7mph

Injen CAI, 55mm TB, P&P Intake, Crower Cams, Hooker Header, ERT/Catco Cat, GS-T Muffler, AFX UDP, Crane Ign Amp, S-AFC

i was a little more than 1 tooth off and it would not start(fuel, cranking and battery going low). Redid the timing by making new line up marks (see my other post). It started right up, did not have to give it ant gas to help it out.

My guess is also that you flooded it, and you probably drained the battery down to nothing too.

Try the easy stuff first, make sure all the sensors are connected properly, then try to run those 30lbs injectors at a little lower base fuel pressure, or use the SAFC, then if that doesn't work check the timing, then check the tough stuff.