OK,, this is a long story..but I planned for this weekend to start my long ass project!! Take out the engine and just... f**ked myself up for 1 month of work, working on it. Since I never did this before, I am really worried. I did did a search in all forum on "knocking", "burn oil", "black engine oil", "rebuild", "lose power" but still doesn't really have my specific answer!;(

Anyway, here is my problem.
First, I just got a new eclipse (1999 GS auto) for my g/f and the car is in pretty good shape, except the noise. (tick tick) noise that won't come up unless I stop of the gas hard like ... step into it for fast acceleration. But after 2 days ago, I drove down to NYC and drove down for about 2.5hours going at constantly at around 80MPH (3200RPM)... the engine is ..f**ked. Before, i don't feel much power, since I have a manual eclipse, the power is so much better, but I thought it's because one is MT, and this is AT. but now .. i do'nt konw. Anyway, after that 2.5 hours of trip, the car makes HUGE noise. even at idle, the engine make ka ka ka ka ka... at around 700RPM.. and as I accelerate, the kakakakaka goes LOUDER and louder and faster also. go proportional to the RPM..... ...after that.. I never tried to go above 2200RPM...

I really need help. I don't konw what's wrong.
The engine oil, I just put them in 1 week ago with new filter, new spark plugs, new PCV, new wires.
and I only drove it for about 300miles even since I bought it. and now the engine oil is BLACK, kinda like... thin, transparent BLACK. I just changed it 1 week ago.. and smile so bad (the oil)... not really alot of smoke, only at start up and "higher" rpm. (white) ... I checked the coolant, no leak.. and for the oil, it didn't really leak. but did go down quicker then my own Eclipse.. but no visual leakage on the ground or around the engine bay area.

What is wrong???? PLEASE help. I am taking it out. I really need help and ideas first!!! PLEASE!!!
Thanks.
GIL

P.S. the car is all in stock, no turbo... no mod.

Uh oh dude!!!! I smell spun bearing :(

Sounds like you spun a rod bearing.


95 Eclipse RS : 5 speed
Jeep TB writeup - http://www.dimensia.com:81/jimbo/JeepTBfor2gnt.html

Thanks guys.... you guys really think it's just a spun bearing?

I mean... I thought the rod was bent or some sort...
Can it be teh rod?

I was thinking that... the rod was bented and start hitting the cylinder wall which caused the knocking.

But if it's a spun bearing, how come the oil is black? and smells like shit.

Coz I thought the ring might be broken also, so the engine oil got into the combustion area and got burned?

If it's really the spun bearing, what will be damaged from it?
Will it be just a bearing change thing? or I have to get a new block, rods, piston, crank, etc???

ALso, I am not looking for a upgrade or somesort, since as I said, it's only for my g/f.. (LOL) she can't drive anyway.. haahaa. .so what's the point to make it faster.

Can you guys give me some more inputs on which parts I have to change, and like gaskets and stuff??? I need more details. Thanks guys!!
Gil.

If you haven't done engine work before you'll need to take it to somebody. If you are mechanically inclined you can pull the engine and save the money there an djust bring the engine to a machine shop to tear it down and rebuild.

It's not easy to break a rod and once you do te engine doesn't run for long before something gets seriously messed up.

You'd be surprised just how loud a spun bearing can be. Get it to a machine shop and see what's wrong. If it's just a spun bearing. Check the oil for metal shavings that a good sign of something wearing wrong in the bearings. If the pistons and everything else is fine. Then it's just a quick turn of the crank to remachine it and some oversized bearings.

Don't drive the car or you'll just increase the damage, but you can do a compression and leak down test to see if there's a problem with the rings or ovaling cylinder walls.



15.9 @ 86.7mph

Injen CAI, 55mm TB, P&P Intake, Crower Cams, Hooker Header, ERT/Catco Cat, GS-T Muffler, AFX UDP, Crane Ign Amp, S-AFC

OK, so it's definitely not the rod.
If it's the bearing, then that means I have to still take off the engine? or can I just take off the oilpan and do it from there?
About the compression test, and ovaling test, waht is the ovaling test?

And again, why is the oil black for a spun bearing?
As I said, should the oil be burn inorder for them to smell like burned and black?
Thanks again. I really apprecaite your inputs..but I really need more inputs. Thanks guys!!!

One more thing, for my current situation, is it that, no matter what, I have to take my engine out, and take it apart inorder to fix it?, bearing or rod, or others?

Coz I am planning to take the engine out this weekend (but ofcourse, if the problem is not that, I don't want to) but in my case, is that the case?
If so, I will just take out the engine, and start from there.
Any inputs?
Thanks.

Yes, you have to remove the engine, because you'll have to machine the crank to remove the damage done by the burned up rob bearing. iff you just throw another bearing in there, you'll spin it again as soon as you start the car.

yes, the oil will be black and burnt from a spun bearing, because there to too much clearnace in between the bearing and the crank for that journal to be properly lubricated, and as such that journal will become overheated, score the crank, rob bearing, and generally make the oil look like ass. Expect a slight grey tint to it as well, because it will be fileld with fine metal shavings. Expect metal in the oilpan, too.

Thank you Darkone.. and all others !
For the spun bearing, if I still drive it, will it damage more?
Should I just get a brand new crankshaft? and all bearings?
WIll the rod be damaged on the spun bearing one?

I am down in NYC now. But I have to get the car back to Albany to get it fix (rebuild there myself) can I make it up there by driving it up?

LIke NO HIGHER then 2000RPM, no faster then 50MPH, no fast acceleration (like 0-60 in 2 minutes), add oil to the car every 20 minutes. is that good to drive it for 2.5 hrs?

How bout I give it a rest after every 1.25 hours?

Thanks guys... thx!!!:thumbsup
Gil

COME ON GUYS.... x(
any inputs??

Don't drive it. Yes it will damage it more. If it gets bad enough you'll sieze the engine and quite possibly ruin the crankshaft.


95 Eclipse RS : 5 speed
Jeep TB writeup - http://www.dimensia.com:81/jimbo/JeepTBfor2gnt.html

OK...for now,
I want to konw, will i have to replace teh BLOCK and the rod and piston, if it's really the spun bearing?

And for the crankshaft... Can I just get a new one? so I do'nt car to drive it?
Or machine it is cheaper? but then I have to ask for a tow truck to tow it for 150 miles... ???

THanks guys. I feel alot better now.. At first, I thoguht I need new block, rod and pistons....

Thx!!!
Gil.:thumbsup :thumbsup :thumbsup

Definetly don't drive it... you'll need to regrind/replace the crankshaft, rod bearings, and seals. I would also get a new oil filter and possibly oil pump to make sure there aren't any metal shavings still in the engine. I spun a bearing and it wasn't pretty. I made the mistake of driving it after changing just the bearing. It ate the new bearing in no time, but i tried to drive it home anyway. It sent a rod threw the block, tore the wrist pin from one of the pistons, and totally destroyed my engine. It looked like someone shot my oil pan point blank with a 12 gauge shotgun.

Holly SHIT... now you definitly scared me!!!! OK OK..I won't drive it.. but what can I do? I mean, .... do I need new rods?... for the oil pump.. how much is it for a brand new?

Can you guys give me a price range for the following?
1) crankshaft (how much for regrind? and replace?)
2) rod bearings (Do I need new rod also?) (new rod bearing for all 4 or just the f**ked up one?)
3) seals (you mean gasket?) (I have question below for this)
4) oil pump (how much?) (need new? or just a used from junkyard)

OK...I am kinda curious for this .... (question I should say)
For the seals. it has a gasket before the bedplate and the oil pan, bedplate and block, block and head, head and valve cover, head and exhaust, and head and intake. I got that right so far???

OK,if I take the engine out, I have to take them all apart, coz it's just too heavy for me to take them in the house afterward.
SO do I need new gasket for all of the above?
ALso, is there any glue or glue (seal type) that I need to put inbetween the parts above? I really want to make sure everything I konw is correct first, buefre I f**k up something and it's too late. I did read alot, and learned alot, but as I said, I never did a engine before (other parts yes). Thanks.
Thanks guys.

Gilbert

Many 420a's have issues with spun bearings, and that's the reason why many people here think that's the problem.

However, if you're lucky, it may only be an issue with a bad lifter or rocker. Open the valve cover and give it a look.

As far as driving it, I wouldn't. You may not get to where your destination is and may do further damage to your engine block depending on the severity of the damage. If you're lucky, your block isn't cracked and you can re-use it with merely new bearings and/or internals.

Check that valve train though. Maybe you'll get lucky. I know Kyle (Fast420a) had a broken rocker before. That would create the noise youre talking about.

Hi, THanks again for the reply.
I just called my friend and my g/f...and talked about what you guys all told me.
Before I called, I was almost (95%) confident about it's a spun bearing. (at least I konw what's wrong) (or ask you said, the rocker - but I doubt it)

First, I don't think it's the top end, coz first, the sound is not from the valve cover, second, the oil is freaking black even I did oil change. (all of them)But still, thanks for teh input..and I wil lchange them.

My first thing to do is to open the oilpan and the valve cover and see the valves and bottom first before I do anything.

ANyway, for my friends I talked to,
They said soemthing about the blue smoke.. Now this is my questions again for all the one who said I got a spun bearing.

Let me tell you all teh symtoms again.
It gives a bad smells from exhaust, kinda white smoke (not huge yet) (maybe blue, dont konw how to say it's blue is blue), knocking sound at ANY RPM (faster as RPM incrase), oil is BLACK (kinda transparent with little things in them, and the car has little power. and the soud comes from teh bottom.

My friend said, the oil might got into the combustion areas and give out the smoke..and etc..... so do you guys still say it's the spun bearing or what?

Also, about my previous message, what's the cost for those things. Thanks gusy!!!! I really thank you guys... and start kissing ya all after I got this mess clean up man!!!!

Gil

Get out there and take your oil pan off. Take a good look at where the rods connect to the crankshaft. Give the rods a shake. Are any of them loose? They shouldnt be.


95 Eclipse RS : 5 speed
Jeep TB writeup - http://www.dimensia.com:81/jimbo/JeepTBfor2gnt.html

Thanks, I will do so by this Friday. I will continue this conversation by then!! :D :D

THanks again guys!! I really appreciate all the help.
Gil:thumbsup

on my talon the way it spun the road bearings is the rings wore down enough to give blow by or a gap that oil can pass through into the combustion chamber. by having blow by not only can oil get in the chamber but it also pressureizes the bottom end which forces oil out the pcv valve/ vent tube....

i lost 4 quarts of oil in 4 hrs of driving the day i spun my rod bearings and yea my oil was very black....

your best bet would be tow it back to you house or use a friends house...

u can get a full upper gasket kit from forum/fenton dodge and a bottom end kit pistons and rings with bearings if u want to....
and its MUCH cheaper then normal dealerships....

if u want to upgrade it theres a few shops that can help ya with that along with myself for a forged internal kit...

Bill

Thanks Motofool.
Hey, about the dodge forum, you guys konw the link to it?
I think I need to change all the gasket on my engine, is that correct?

http://www.neons.org/forumdodge/ Make sure you mention you are with 2GNT for the discount.

The number of gaskets you needs depends on the extend of the damage, you may need a few bottom end gaskets and a set of bearings, or you make esentially need to replace them all because the whole thing will be apart, just depends on what is damaged and to what extent.



15.9 @ 86.7mph

Injen CAI, 55mm TB, P&P Intake, Crower Cams, Hooker Header, ERT/Catco Cat, GS-T Muffler, AFX UDP, Crane Ign Amp, S-AFC

THanks for the link... about the bearing.
I have to change all 4 rod bearing.
But do I have to change the main bearing also?
I called up a auto shop. and they said the crankshaft is for $160, and each rod bearing is $1.70.
But they said the main bearing has to cost $170. THat's alot.. is that usual? Do I really ahve t change that main bearing?
Thanks.

ALso, is there any bottom end gasket kit?
And about thise gasket, do I need any seal glue? coz I see online that people put that bedplate in and they use some red glue type of seal between the block and the bedplate.

Thanks!!
Gil

You're gonna have to take the crankshaft out. If it's salvagable, then I think it would be much cheaper. If its scuffed you could have it polished, and if it's gouged you could have it machined. You have to take it out anyway, so I'd just take it to a machine shop and see if they could fix it before blowing money on a new one.

That sounds way high for main bearings. You can get Clevite 77s from Howell for $40 http://www.howellautomotive.com/Howell/Store/catalog/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=142_38_84&products_id=493 With the Clevites I think you may need 2 sets because you're a 95. If I'm not mistaken, the lock tabs are on opposite sides for the 95 so you'de need to use to two sets of top shells. You could just get a set of togas with the locks on the correct side pn MBC26E for $39 http://www.importperformanceparts.net/imports/bearings_topeagle.html

Sealant for the bedplate - http://forums.2gnt.com/dcboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=5&topic_id=46381&mesg_id=46381&listing_type=search

And, yeah there's a lower end gasket set that comes with all of the gaskets/orings that you need. Howell sells them for $60


95 Eclipse RS : 5 speed
Jeep TB writeup - http://www.dimensia.com:81/jimbo/JeepTBfor2gnt.html

>THanks for the link... about the bearing.
>I have to change all 4 rod bearing.

You don't have to change all 4 rod bearings if you don't want to, although you might as well do it while yer there. If a rod bearing is spun, you will be able to tell when you drop the oil pan. There should be 0 up and down movement, and just a hair of side to side movement along the axis of the crankshaft if the bearing is in good condition. If one of them is spun, make sure you get the crank and the rod machined at a machine shop and use an oversize bearing, not a stock replacement one.

>But do I have to change the main bearing also?

There are multiple main bearings including the thrust bearing in the center section of the crank. If none of them are spun, then none of them will need replacement.

>I called up a auto shop. and they said the crankshaft is for
>$160, and each rod bearing is $1.70.
>But they said the main bearing has to cost $170. THat's
>alot.. is that usual? Do I really ahve t change that main
>bearing?

You must have missunderstood what part the dealer was quoting you when you heard 170 for a main bearing. Main bearings are close to the same price as rod bearings. Maybe 170 was for the bedplate that the lower halfs of each main bearing sits in.

>ALso, is there any bottom end gasket kit?

Yes, you can order both top and bottom end gasket kits from the dealer. As previously stated above, I would recommend buying all dealer parts from Bob Kise at Forum Dodge. He gives very good prices.

>And about thise gasket, do I need any seal glue? coz I see
>online that people put that bedplate in and they use some red
>glue type of seal between the block and the bedplate.

When you seal the bedplate to the block, you don't use a gasket. All you need is a good anerobic sealant available at any auto part store. I believe the factory service manual calls for some specific loctite, but you can double check that yourself (see below).

I suggest that you go here and download the factory service manual for proper procedures and torque specs: http://www.heavenz-not-0verflowing.com/files/. You should also take a good look at the parts diagrams on the main site here: http://www.2gnt.com/CAPS/main0sub0.html.

>Thanks!!

You're welcome ;)

Thanks Matt_95tsg and MetalJim. you guy's info is GREAT!!! BTW, the car I will be working on is a 1996 GS auto Eclipse. (my g/f)

OK, so if I spun the rod, I have to get the rod machined also? I thought it's only the crankshaft.

anyway, other then the above question.
I have this one question relating to how I take the engine out.
OK, first, I have to tell you guys my situation.
I od'nt have a garage. But I love playing with cars, mech and so on... I been doing everything myself with the car EXCEPT THE ENGINE. I konw I konw, engine is totally different and so much harder...but I am willing to learn and try. I want to konw my car more!!!
OK now, I will be working in a parking lot. (my high school lot) over the weekend. So I have to use 3 days to take my engine out.

QUESTION BELOW:
==relating to take out engine==
1) I will use a lifter, but still, I have to take it apart before I can bring them into the house. Since I will put each piece into my other car's truck and drive them back home. OK, can I do this? take off the oilpan, then valve cover, then the exhaust, then intake manifold, then take off the head. (they all light) Now, I unbolt the tranny from the block, and use the lifter to take out the block. IS THAT GOOD?? is the step ok? did I miss anything? Other then hose and wires, any other parts I have to take off first?

2) if the tranny is in the car when I take out the engine block, how should I take the block out? tilt it?

3) If I leave my tranny in the car, will the tranny fell off after the engine is gone?

==relating to after engine is out==
1) after engine is out and so on but tranny is still in... and all other things are tight and secured... Can I put the car into neutral (AT) and just push my car to the side street of my apartment? or I can't move the car???


THANKS GUYS.. PLEASE.. .PLEASE... answer all the above question asap. I will start the work on Friday noon.. so I want to prepare myself before then. THANKS GUYS... please, try to answer them with the question numbers, so I can konw exactly the answer for each questions. Thanks man... I love you all!!!! As I said, Eclipse are the best, ... I just don't konw why people (my friend) always say it's shit. Just wait till I get my eclipse to Stage III (will be by then end of this year) heehee.
:thumbsup

Thanks again/
Gilbert

I haven't been following the post but I'l answer some of your questions.
--The Crank and ALL 4 rod big ends must be checked and machined together. That's what I'd do to prevent future failures/problems.
-- Spend $15 and get yourself a Chiltons. They have a decent way of pulling the motor. Our motors have two hoist spots. One to the right of the exhaust manifold and the other towards the back of the thermostat housing. If you can get a leveler, do it. If not, then just be careful.
-- You can do either. You can pull just the motor or both ATX/motor together. I'd just do the first. I'd go hunt down a POS tire or two and tie the motor in your buddies truck down with the sump of the pan inside the tires. If your careful, you won't harm your oil pan. I would NOT remove the pan or Valve cover if you don't have to until you get the motor somewhere you can work on it. Just a good way of keeping crap out of your valvetrain/rotating assembly.
-- Bring some bailing wire to tie the tranny up and make detail notes of all connections and where they went. I tape them w/ a description of where they go.
-- You can move the car w/ it in neutral, but try to keep the tranny tied up at the same level as it did w/ the motor attached. Otherwise you might try to put your CV's in a bind.(not likely, but you don't want extra problems)
-- Just take your time! Drink some Dew's and see if you can get a buddy or two to help. Also have fun with it.

leave the intake mani because it will be a pain in the buttocks to squeeze your hand in there to take it off. Take off the headers and down pipe. Tranny should be held together by six bolts. Disconnect all engine wires and hoses. Watch out when you disconnect the cooler system because freon will come splashing out like old faithful. Dino forgot to tell me that when he walked me through, he had a good laugh. Drain the radiator fluid and all engine and tranny oil. Dont forger about the throttle cable. If you plan to take the engine out with the tranny it is tricky but you can do it. Remove radiator and fan because it will make it easier. Engine has to come out at an almost 45 degree angle. Passeneger side first. There are 4 motor mounts that are easily accessible. Oh yes the battery mount, pain in the ass! You will need to get creative and use box wrench and extension and socket. Play with it. There are two bolts that hold that bracket. When you get down and dirty with the engine just post. Once you see the layout and obstacles, it's easier for us to walk you through it.

THNK YOU GUYS. As soon as I got the engine out and take it apart,
I will post them up and ask you guys every detail I can think of. lol.
ALso, I will try to take alot of pictures for future references.. THx.

You all all say that I should not take the engine apart in the car?
So I should just lift the whole engine out, then take it apart, and bring them into my apartment?

Thanks.

My biggest recommendation for this is to find a friend who has done this before, or at least helped in doing it. Experience is a good thing to have around. Most definately pick up a Chiltons.

I say get the intake manifold off (sp there more room to play with) and pull the engine/trans as one, separate it once the it's out of the car. Check the main page there should be a link to removing the axles, which can be a bit of a pain.

First drain the fluids then disconnect wiring harnesses and vaccum hoses. Then start unbolting everything.

When you hook the engine lift up, with a chain or leveler make it so the engine willtil at a big angle, around 45 degrees, so short chain to the timing belt side of the engine and long side of teh chain to the trans side. Then undo front and rear motor mounts and drop the cross member. Bring tension up on the lift and remove the side mounts, adjust the engine lift as needed and she should slide right out.

Now be warned it is not as simple as it sounds, and not something you want to do by yourself, you're gonna need some extra hands. Preferably ones with some experience with engines.



15.9 @ 86.7mph

Injen CAI, 55mm TB, P&P Intake, Crower Cams, Hooker Header, ERT/Catco Cat, GS-T Muffler, AFX UDP, Crane Ign Amp, S-AFC

Thanks again.
I do have the chilton. I had that for 2 years now.
But thanks for saying it. It did help me through alot of tough time...

Anyway,
ok, this is what I will do, I hope it make sence. (they will be the exact check off list for me. Please see if I missed any. Thx.

NOTE: I WON'T REMOVE THE TRANNY.

1) spray WD-40 to all bolts I can reach.
2) drain engine oil, tranny oil, and coolant. (brake fluid?)
3) unplug all wires and host and mark which is which to where.
4) Do I need to remove the battery, and ECU?
5) unbolt the exhaust manifold.
6) unbolt the intake manifold.
7) Do I need to remove the timing belt first?
8) remove the fan (which is with the radiator)
9) Now unbolt the tranny from the engine.

-- WHEN I DO STEP 9, Do I have to hold the Tranny or somewhat? I mean will the tranny fall if I take out the engine? or something is seperate from engine that holds the tranny in position?

10) use the Engine Lifter, connect to the TWO holes on Engine head.
11) remove the engine mount (do I need to do this step?)
12) lift out the engine in 45 degree (valve cover, head, block)

-- QUESTION BELOW (last step)
13) When the engine is out and on the lifter, Now what? What do I need to do for me to take the engine into parts of head, block and etc apart? coz it's too heavy for me to bring it back into my apartment.

Please tell me if any of the above step is needed or don't need. Or any thing I need to do inbetween. I mean, things that will help my life easier, things that I won't expect (unexpected), and what is easy to F**K up, and what steps I have to be extremely careful and which step is HELL, and so on.. etc.. THANKS ALOT FOR ANY INPUT!

Thanks guys.
My exciting day is coming up!!!
Gil.:thumbsup

--Leave the brake fluid alone.
--Good idea just to pull the battery out and save a potential fire if you later forget unbolt your wires from it.
--Timing belt can stay together on the motor.
--Yes the tranny will try to fall over and it will need to be tied up. It has mounts but you don't want to put any unwanted stress.
--When you get to step 13, then post b/c you might be too tired to want to mess with taking a motor apart that day.
-- For reference, I can get the 420A out of a neon in about 3 hours. That's with a buddy, and Neon's are a tad more friendlier than our 2gnt's. A word of advice, you will finish much faster by taking your time,taking breaks, and being careful rather than trying to hurry though it or being too rough on a part that will break and take more time to fix.

Thanks man. but still,
1) do I need to remove the engine mount? (or it just sits there or connected to the engine and the body?)
2) As I said, I am doing this at a HIGH SCHOOL parking lot, I can't just leave the engine outside for over nite, that shit will be GONE!!!
I have to take it apart and bring it into my basement.

I will do everythin above (previous message) just before unbolt tranny and lift engine. I will save that for 2nd day. So now, what do I do for that engine? how can I take it apart from the lifter?? any steps?? please, I need detail steps from now on (after step 12)

Thanks again, anyone else with their input for my previous post?
Thanks.
Gil

Sup Guys.
I will doing my engine rebuild this weekend. starting by this Friday.
Anyway, still need the answer for the above 2 questions.

1) need engine mount to be removed?
2) how do I take the engine apart after engine lifted out of the car?
I mean do I do it while on the lift? etc??? which part first and so on.. steps please.

Thanks guys... I just hope everything will go well tomorrow.. thanks for all the hlep agian.
Gil

sounds like a good time to go with the howell 2.2l stroker, you can save some money by turing in your old engine as your core.
that's what i would shoot for if i had the cash.
-drew

I think the first thing I'd like to ask is, do you really know what the problem is yet? I don't know what kind of time constraint you are on with this, but what if Jason is right and its just a sloppy lifter? Wouldn't that be a pisser? I'd hate to see anyone needlessly commit to an expensive and timeconsuming rebuild. Maybe you could just go out there and see what the problem really is before deciding on how to fix it. Maybe if you could spend a week, looking for a garage to rent. Then you could have the car towed there, and work on it without worrying about people taking stuff and parts getting rained on and whatnot. I don't know man. I've done a wheel bearing on the side of the road, a couple of u-joints deep in the woods, and even a clutch in a work parking lot...but dissasembling the engine? I'm just not sure that you want to be doing that in a parking lot.

How many people are going to be in this parking lot?

2 strong guys might be able to move an assembled block without the head - maybey. If you had 3 other guys(besides yourself), then moving the block shouldn't be a problem. You could take the head off to make it that much easier.

If you're the ONLY guy in this parking lot, then you'll need to dissasemble it. You can carry all of the peices individually, but the effer is heavy when its assembled. Get yourself an engine stand. Lift the engine out and put it on the stand. Then take the head off, take the pistons/rods out, turn it over, take the bedplate and crank off.

Just one more thing...if you assemble the engine in the basement, you will NEED those other guys(probably 3 other guys) to carry the fully assembled block(including head) back upstairs and into the truck or all the way to high school or whatever. I don't think there's any getting around that one.


95 Eclipse RS : 5 speed
Jeep TB writeup - http://www.dimensia.com:81/jimbo/JeepTBfor2gnt.html

taking off the rear and front mount is helpful when removing engine, but not necessary. Oh big word of advice. Muslces are not alway the aswer to taking off those tight bolts i.e the bolts to the cross member. Get a long hollow crowbar, slip that ratchet or wrench in there and let physics do the work. Use same method for any hard bolts, that is if clearance is enough. As for the axles. Take off any bolt that is necassry so you have room play with the rotors. Not sure if it's 32mm socket for the axle nut itself. But when you do get the axles off the rotors stick a crow bar between the grean boot and the tranny itself and just tap/pry it apart. To make it easier you might also want to try and turn the axle at the same time, wiggling it out. Getting the right angle is trial and error. I had to take my engine out 3 times in matter of 3 weeks. The third time took me just about an hour. And have a friend or two.

THanks guys. I appreciated all you guys' input.
OK.
First, I went to the Autozone today. They said they don't give out engine lifter. And if I get one from then (new) cost $350. That's ALOT!! Where can I get an engine stand and lifter??

Second, I won't be going to stroker or some sort. As I said, this is my g/f Eclipse. Mine in the other hand, I got my custom Turbo (stage II) kit all ready and set. But I will wait till September for my motor to get rebuild then I will go straight to Stage III .. Can't wait!!

Now... back to this Rebuild issue.

I have questions. PLEASE, answer them. I still didn't get the answer yet from all the above replies.

1) If I take the engine apart WHILE IN THE CAR. take off the head, and now only the block in the car with the tranny. Can I unbolt the tranny, THEN use the lifter or some whatever to take the block out?? Is there any holes or spot on the block that I can hook to to lift it out?? (without the head)

2) I talked to Autozone, he asked if I have power tools. the answer is NO. I do have ALOT of tools, and I should be enough. But now, that guy scared me this morning. He said I CAN"T (NO WAY) to take teh crank out WITHOUT power tool. Is that true??? please tell me (give me a before hand ready) will I have a HORRIBLE time using NON-POWER tools compare to power tools? Also, Can I still take off teh crank without power tools???? Thanks.

3) FINALLY, The thing I worried the most is the BOLTS, are they easy to break off??? I mean, I bought 2 bottles of WD-40 already. But still, I worried. If I use the long hollow steel pipe, and as you said, use physics do the work. The length and force, will that be TOO MUCH that will break the bolt?? Question!! IS THE BOLTS EASY TO BREAK????

Thanks guys.
All the questions I still haven't konw is the above 3. Please answer them for me. I will post alot of pictures tonite or tomororw!!! I will keep you all up to day.

P.S. BTW, I will take off the valve cover FIRST, and see if it's the valves... so I won't be that stupid.. =) Thanks guys...

Gil.:wary

Pray for my success!!! I am extremely worried, kinda nervous, and maybe a little scared, and ALOT ALOT ALOT of excited feelings. I just hope they are all positive!!!
Gil.:thumbsup

Yes you do have to remove front and rear motor mounts. The front attaches to the block, and you're not going to pull the engine without undoing it. The rear attaches to the trans, but ifyou want to pull the engine and leave the trans you'll need to undo that mount to tbe able to get the angle heed to seprate the block and trans.

How easy are the bolts to break? Just depends on age rust and general condition of the bolt. Have a good breaker bar, a cheater bar is handy to have as well. Yes you get the crank out with power tools, but you are going to need a pulley puller for the crank and a puller for the crank sprocket.

My biggest bit of advice when removing an engine or any car repair:
Don't go in assuming everything will go smoothly and that nothignwill break or cause you grief. I go in now not asking will something break, but rather what will break or how much will break.

Remember: "It's never easy."

Good luck.



15.9 @ 86.7mph

Injen CAI, 55mm TB, P&P Intake, Crower Cams, Hooker Header, ERT/Catco Cat, GS-T Muffler, AFX UDP, Crane Ign Amp, S-AFC

Thanks again.
Any other input?
I still didnt get the answer for #1 yet. Thanks.
#1 (about if I can take out the block in the car when no head) (any hole or holder for me to connect the chain to on the block. Thanks man.

So you saying if I do'nt have power tools, I just CAN"T take off the crank shaft?

Thanks for you advice man.. I konw what ya mean... it's going to be tough and hard..but I will do it.. And I will!!

Gil:thumbsup

Sup guys. After 4 hours straight working on the car today (4PM - 8PM) I finally got some stuff out.
I got the fan, header, AC compressor, power steering, coolant hose, battery (tray also), oil, coolant, all electric wires, and plugs.

NOW, I am left with Generator, whole engine (cover, head, block, oilpan, intake), and the engine mounts...

QUESTION:
1) I CAN"T FIND where I can drain the tranny fluid... I got ATX, I can't find it in the book or etc... HELP.

2) Do I need to remove the cam before I take out the head?

3) Should I leave the intake with the head when I take the head away from the block?

4) Should I take off the engine mount first, then use the engine lifter? or after the lifter is in place then I unbolt the mount?

THANKS GUYS.
I am going to wake up tomorrow at 9AM and start again.
Wish me luck. THANKS!!!
Gil:thumbsup :thumbsup

Also I took some pictures... but I will do it more, I will post them tomororw... so tired tonite.:wary
Gil