Just curious if anyone advanced the timing on their DSM? I was thinkin of doin it, but dont know how safe and effective it really is. Any help is appreciated.

You cant do it on our cars.

actually you might be able to

I'm working on it with an Apexi ITC, so is Michael 97RS but I think he's further along than I am.

well i knew you guys were working on it, but didnt know how far along you guys had come yet. How much of a gain can be had by advancing the timing??

if you guys have an AIT (air intake temperature) sensor. I don't know if you guys do or don't.. but you can easily hack one of those and make it think the car is getting colder air, therfore advancing the timing. I have it done on my car. I haven't gotten an detonation and i'm not running on premium, but it's winter time, so the air actually is cold.. we'll see how well it does in the summer.

but I'm also thinking.. you guys probably don't have an AIT.. anyone know?

i beleive we do have an air intake temp sensor, cuz when i dataloggd my ride, i could view the intake temps.
im not sure if we could hack it, but im down!! if we can. vegas summer is 110+degrees, and my engine/radiator dont like it at all...

tia

Unfortunately Todd, I'm just looking into the ITC, don't have the unit yet. That's not one of the parts in the pile in my room. But soom I may need to retard instead of advance... }> so I may not need the ITC...

"The world is a dangerous place to live; not because of the people who are evil, but because of the people who don't do anything about it." - Albert Einstein



Michael J. Kulaga
e-mail: Michael_97RS@2gntDSM.zzn.com aol IM: MJKulga
http://highlander.dsmpower.com/

Injen CAI, 55mm TB, Hooker 4-1 Stepped Header, GS-T Muffler, AFX UDP, S-AFC, 8.5mm Magnecor Wires, Crane Fireball HI-6DI2, SS Clutch Line, NRG Susp. Motor Mount Ins., FU/RU/RL STBs, TSW Blade 17x7.5, Bridgestone Potenza RE730 215/45ZR-17. Front KVR Cross-Drilled Rotors & Carbon Fiber Pads

To Be Installed: Ported/Polished Intake Manifold 1/2, Rear disc brake conversion kit w/, Rear KVR Cross Drilled Rotors & Carbon Fiber Kevlar Pads, SS Brake Lines

since our cars run on 87 octane, I think there is a significant gain to be made from advancing the timing (you'd notice it by using the "butt-o-meter")

I've been in vegas during the summer.. hot shit, was like 115 I think during the day. problem you get when it's that hot.. is that if you hack the PCM and tell it the air it's taking in is actually 60 degrees (or whatever) unless you run high octane you are gonna get detonation and then your computer will just retard the timing. So ya gotta be careful with it (or so other zx2 guys have told me) and I haven't run it during the warm summer yet (ususally around 80-95 here) and so i'm probably gonna have to be carefully of how high i turn it up, unless I want to start putting in premo gas. which is expensive as hell around here.. hehe.

Whats the mod you zx2 guys are doing to the AIT?

________________________________________________________________________________________
current status - No 3rd Gear synchro


http://hometown.aol.com/ohshootuhh/
www.Fast420A.com

adding a 0-50K OHM pots inline with IAT sensor wire to the PCM, turning up the resistance on the POT makes the PCM think the air temperature is colder then it is.. but general we have to use that in conjunction with another pot on the ECT (Engine coolant temperature) sensor to make it think the engine is still needing to be warmed up and so therefore richens up the mixture.. I'm not exactly sure how it all works, but thing sure feels faster and the guy that thought it up dyno'd it and got some impressive numbers.

so Todd and Mike, could this work for our cars???

The ECU can advance timing correct? So, when you say you want to advance timing, do you mean beyond what the ECU can do? I'm a little confused...



Eric Madden

Yes, for good performance with premium fuel our ECU does not advancee timing enough. I think the most people have seem is 20-25 degrees advance. The AFX ECU's advance timing up to 30 degrees.

"The world is a dangerous place to live; not because of the people
who are evil, but because of the people who don't do anything about it." - Albert Einstein



Michael J. Kulaga
e-mail: Michael_97RS@2gntDSM.zzn.com aol IM: MJKulga
http://highlander.dsmpower.com/

Injen CAI, 55mm TB, Hooker 4-1 Stepped Header, GS-T Muffler, AFX UDP, S-AFC, 8.5mm Magnecor Wires, Crane Fireball HI-6DI2, SS Clutch Line, NRG Susp. Motor Mount Ins., FU/RU/RL STBs, TSW Blade 17x7.5, Bridgestone Potenza RE730 215/45ZR-17. Front KVR Cross-Drilled Rotors & Carbon Fiber Pads

To Be Installed: Ported/Polished Intake Manifold 1/2, Rear disc brake conversion kit w/, Rear KVR Cross Drilled Rotors & Carbon Fiber Kevlar Pads, SS Brake Lines

In theory, but ther would be R&D needed. The car will try to warm up the car if it's cooler. I don't know that I would do anythign like this without and S-AFC. Because if I remember right, the computer also dumps more fuel in, so you would need to lean it out... oncec again. You would need a datalogger and some testing to get the right numbers you want. You would need to match Coolant temp and intake sensors so ECU didn't think things were wrong.

I'm also not sure what else the ECU would do in this case.

Corbin... any thoughts?

"The world is a dangerous place to live; not because of the people who are evil, but because of the people who don't do anything about it." - Albert Einstein



Michael J. Kulaga
e-mail: Michael_97RS@2gntDSM.zzn.com aol IM: MJKulga
http://highlander.dsmpower.com/

Injen CAI, 55mm TB, Hooker 4-1 Stepped Header, GS-T Muffler, AFX UDP, S-AFC, 8.5mm Magnecor Wires, Crane Fireball HI-6DI2, SS Clutch Line, NRG Susp. Motor Mount Ins., FU/RU/RL STBs, TSW Blade 17x7.5, Bridgestone Potenza RE730 215/45ZR-17. Front KVR Cross-Drilled Rotors & Carbon Fiber Pads

To Be Installed: Ported/Polished Intake Manifold 1/2, Rear disc brake conversion kit w/, Rear KVR Cross Drilled Rotors & Carbon Fiber Kevlar Pads, SS Brake Lines

Mike, How is your car running in these temps? My car feels like a rocket! Since the EGT is disabled and its 0 degrees outside my car has been flying everwhere especialy when the motors cold.
If we could advance I think it would make a big differance.

The only reasons i did it is because, the throttle response feels really good when it's on (NOTE: with what I was talking about.. you can't leave it on all the time, alteast with our PCM's they will evenetual cancel out the extra resistance in the line if you use it all the time, I only use it when racing someone, or having fun ;) ) but the car does "feel" quite a bit faster, I had CluckeRMC ride in my car and turned them on and he said it made a noticiable difference. but the main thing is that for the way I set it up.. it cost me about 7 dollars in radio shack parts, and it made a difference you can "feel" it's suppose to work better on vehicles that have more "freed" up intakes and exhuast (which leans out the mixture of course) so then this will richen the mixture back up and advance the timming some. and make it so that your engine can effectivly use premo gas right (if you tune it enough) but the guy that did it to his car (has a good intake and exhaust) said that in the upper RPMs (not peak) he gained about 10HP from it. but this is all based on the Zetec motor and it's electrical system. So I don't know if you could or if it'd be worth it on a 2gnt.

sorry for the long post.. just trying to get everything out there.

Another problem is that the ECU is only programmed to advance so far, so no matter how much tinkering you can only get so far. Until AFX finished the ECU or you go stand alone ECU.

"The world is a dangerous place to live; not because of the people who are evil, but because of the people who don't do anything about it." - Albert Einstein



Michael J. Kulaga
e-mail: Michael_97RS@2gntDSM.zzn.com aol IM: MJKulga
http://highlander.dsmpower.com/

Injen CAI, 55mm TB, Hooker 4-1 Stepped Header, GS-T Muffler, AFX UDP, S-AFC, 8.5mm Magnecor Wires, Crane Fireball HI-6DI2, SS Clutch Line, NRG Susp. Motor Mount Ins., FU/RU/RL STBs, TSW Blade 17x7.5, Bridgestone Potenza RE730 215/45ZR-17. Front KVR Cross-Drilled Rotors & Carbon Fiber Pads

To Be Installed: Ported/Polished Intake Manifold 1/2, Rear disc brake conversion kit w/, Rear KVR Cross Drilled Rotors & Carbon Fiber Kevlar Pads, SS Brake Lines

I'm not sure, but I don't think it's give more than a degree or two at the most, since with what little temp AND timing data logging I've done, I haven't noticed a significant correlation between lower temps and more timing advance

We need another 5-6 degrees advance while naturally aspirated AT LEAST, preferrably 10 degrees (30 deg advance at WOT would be nice)

Exactly Todd... so instal your ITC!!!!!

"The world is a dangerous place to live; not because of the people who are evil, but because of the people who don't do anything about it." - Albert Einstein



Michael J. Kulaga
e-mail: Michael_97RS@2gntDSM.zzn.com aol IM: MJKulga
http://highlander.dsmpower.com/

Injen CAI, 55mm TB, Hooker 4-1 Stepped Header, GS-T Muffler, AFX UDP, S-AFC, 8.5mm Magnecor Wires, Crane Fireball HI-6DI2, SS Clutch Line, NRG Susp. Motor Mount Ins., FU/RU/RL STBs, TSW Blade 17x7.5, Bridgestone Potenza RE730 215/45ZR-17. Front KVR Cross-Drilled Rotors & Carbon Fiber Pads

To Be Installed: Ported/Polished Intake Manifold 1/2, Rear disc brake conversion kit w/, Rear KVR Cross Drilled Rotors & Carbon Fiber Kevlar Pads, SS Brake Lines

Todd, whats the problem with the IAC install? I haven't been able to find much info on it online to see what connections there are to know if I want to buy one.


________________________________________________________________________________________
current status - No 3rd Gear synchro


http://hometown.aol.com/ohshootuhh/
www.Fast420A.com

The problem isn't necessarly installing it. The wiring should be rather straightforward.

The problem is if the thing will actually WORK. There are all these switches on the back of the thing. There are 8 "up or down" switches, and I have an IDEA of what to set those to (all in the up position, thnks to what very small amount of information the phone jockey at Apexi was able to tell me, but the first one is actually a maximum limit switch. In the UP position the max timing change is +/- 5, in the down it's +/- 15). But there are two other switches as well, a "car select" and a "type select" switch. Both have about 10 different settings.

The thing is what the hell does "car select" and "type select" mean??? Which settings are the correct ones? Are there any settings which will actually work with our cars???

I don't want to go through the hassle of tearing up my wiring harness and putting the thing in if NONE of the car select or type select settings will actually work.

I am going to try and find out what they mean, and what the different settings correspond to, before installation. That's why I haven't gotten around to it.

Actually, if anyone else wants to help do the legwork on this, that would be great. I need to find out what the different settings on the car select and type secect switches mean, and if that is compatible with our engine.