Ask the elders. Haha.

So, as a few of you may know from my other thread, The headgasket is going in my car. It's in the garage, and I have a car to drive until I figure out what to do. So here's my dilema, I've got about $1,200.00 MAX to spend....I'm torn between just rebuilding the block with some fresh insides and getting it back to its glory with a nice rebuild OR I found a 2000 Plymouth Breeze motor at a local yard. 20k miles, $650 bucks.

So, with that budget, what's gonna be the best path? Or most logical with my budget? Could I actually pull of the 2.4 swap on that budget? I've been reading alot on the swap, so I know about everything that has to be done.

What would you do?

if you have read the information you know what has to be done, and therefore about what it will cost.

If you can source an oil pan, motor mount, lengthen the DP, and have fuel control of some form, the rest is nothing difficult.

Consider alternator, ps, & ac if you want to keep them.

For an easy motor swap just rebuild your 420a.

I would just rebuild. You are on a budget, don't take on a project that will require a lot of modification and small cost items (they add up.) If you see yourself wanting performance someday, forget the 2.4 and just stick to a well constructed turbo setup with light-weight rims.

From reading your write up, I can use the PT non turbo alt bracket, I'm not running A/C and the power steering goes off of the SRT pass MM. So that stuff is covered. 24 lb injectors. SRT oil pan and pick up. 1g eclipse mm. head gasket. head studs. my head milled. cut and weld the mm and oil pan. Of course, the coil, injector wiring, and cam magnet. I guess I just think it's possible to wrap up everything else with $550 after i have the engine.

And really, I'd rather have the end result be an engine with 20k miles and around 185 hp over my engine (with 147k) rebuilt and back to square 1 with 140 hp for the same money spent. I mean, if it came down to it, I could prolly pull out another $300 or so to get the swap done.

I do not know what to tell you. If you have the means and the time/patience then go for it. If you your timeline is shortened and the 2GNT needs to get up and running the 420a is the easier route.

The car I'm using I can have for about 3-4 weeks.

i'd just redo the HG, and reuse everything. Drive it until you save up more money, then do something major, like a swap. Then you'll have a spare motor on the side, or a spare to sell to recoupe some of the costs of the new, major, setup.

3-4 weeks you say? Yea, I think Dave will be the first to tell you that is not realistic for the EDZ swap.

Just rebuild with forged internals, mill the head, add in new valvetrain components, make sure you get good hardware and gaskets, and you are all set for some serious power upgrades.

And then I'm all set for what, turbo? sorry. I don't wanna go turbo. It just seems pointless to dump all this money into it and come out with 140-150hp. Like its been said a million times, the 420a (streetable/DD) can't be fast unless you go turbo. And I don't want to. I'd rather have the 2.4 with supporting mods and be close to 200.

And just curious as to why you think this swap can't be done in that time frame? A few different write-ups I've seen ballpark 20-25 hours.

There aren't performance parts for the EDZ really. I've looked. There's tons of crap for the 420a, but noone makes cloud cars "perform". Also, I wouldn't expect it to be done in 4 weeks unless you work every waking hour on it.

No performance parts for the EDZ? Haha...

Originally posted by nicho919
There aren't performance parts for the EDZ really. I've looked.

What are you looking for? My EDZ has Crower rods, JE pistons, a slew of ARP fasteners and an Ishihara-Johnson crank scraper/baffle/windage tray. The top end is all 420a materials.

There is no reason why you cant put out around 180-200 HP on a built 420A. Mark puts out around 212 IIRC.

Its all up to you. A 420A rebuild is of course easier than the EDZ swap, but pumping out 200HP in N/A trim is no easy task..

Just curious..what is your issue with the turbo route?

Yeah, but Mark's is a race car. Stripped and all. My car is and will be a daily driver, on pump gas, that I get back and forth to work and pick up my daughter from school in. Haha.

Why no turbo? I don't have a real clear answer for you, just not for me I guess. Maybe it's because I've never had a turbo car and/or dealt with one in any way. And it's also the thing that there's tons of 420a-t's out there and not as many 420a/EDZ's. Something a little different.

So, in the event that I just do a rebuild, What should absolutely be replaced and what can I re-use without any issues? Just doing some clickin around on partdinosaur I came up with $750...but that was replacing everything.

Crank and rods are fine to reuse if you haven't had any actual damage. Pistons are ok too unless you're planning on overboring or already damaged. Last time I rebuilt my 420a I just tore it down, rehoned and reringed with fresh rings and new bearings, ran fine until I shot an alternator belt into the timing belt. Didn't even have any piston slap.

Originally posted by irregular defect
So, in the event that I just do a rebuild, What should absolutely be replaced and what can I re-use without any issues?

Depends on how much wear exists on your internals. As previously said your crank and rods as long as they spec out properly. Pistons are ok to reuse on a budget rebuild as long as your cylinders do not have any out of round or taper. Never reuse rings or bearings of course.

Day 1





How the fuck do you get these 2 bolts out?!?



Ripped out the EGR system and just got a block-off kit on Ebay, CEL be damned. The thing pissed me off and is gone.

Cams look good, no scratches of any sort. BUT spark plug in Cylinder 1 was soaked in oil, so I'm hoping thats because of the headgasket and not ring failure, we'll see.

Hahaha. Yeah, those bolts are a bitch. There are 10,000,000 posts in here about them though.

Jack it up and move it around until you can get them out. Alternatively, buy a Makita.

Looks like relatively slow progress, but as long as you take your time, you'll be OK. COVER THAT SHIT UP. Don't let it open like that.

The bolt in the back you jack up a tad until you can completely loosen it.

Leave it in the hole.

The front bolt I would take out first. Jack the motor up and take the bolt out over the hard lines there.

Now, with the back bolt still in, maneuver the whole mount out with that bolt in it.

Thats how I do it anyway.

Originally posted by irregular defect
How the fuck do you get these 2 bolts out?!?

undo the rear motor mount and put a jack with a wood block under the oil pan. Jack the engine sky high. They'll come right out. sometimes getting the rear mount to line up again can be a pain, but not as much as those bolts IMO.

I plan on getting the Prothane mount kit, So it'll get unbolted one way or the other. Thanks guys.

Removed the bolt for the rear motor mount, jacked it up....and wahlah. Points to you Tek.

So funny story and reader beware....haha. Awhile back, getting my oil changed(it was winter, like 20 below didn't feel like doing it myself) I wander my way out while they have my car on the lift to check out everything undernearth and they're like, dude..you need a new oil pan, I look and its super dented and rusted as shit. So in epic fail mindset, I forget about it. Got a new one from a guy parting out his car during the summer, and its been sitting in the garage. Now that I'm doing all this, using the oil pan to jack the motor up....last night....it gave way, started dripping oil right from the bottom of the pan, all I could do was laugh about it.





So, needless to say, the new oil pan is on.

Just called to rent the 3 jaw 5 ton pulller, vatozone wants $70 bucks. O'rielly's wants 52. both fully refundable and no time limit....but damn, I thought I heard around here it was only 30-40 bucks..not 70. Anyways, off to O'rielly.

Tek didn't say to unbolt the rear mount.

The autozone puller is a chrysler specific puller that works amazingly, Oreilley's is a generic 3 jaw that can damage the threads on your crank snout. It did on mine.

The one I just rented from O'rielly said "Chrysler harmonic balancer remover". Tool worked just fine, but man that thing was a bitch. I should of rented an impact while I was at it.

Originally posted by RoninEclipse2G
Tek didn't say to unbolt the rear mount. The autozone puller is a chrysler specific puller that works amazingly, Oreilley's is a generic 3 jaw that can damage the threads on your crank snout. It did on mine.

I think he meant the rear bolt on the side MM.

:P

Head is out. What a pain in the dick.

Dropped the head off at the machine shop, dropped of some misc parts at the powder coaters.

Any tips on cleaning the cylinders/block surface?

And WTF is the lower intake still holding on to? What is that black box? I took out the bolts on the back of the intake and the ones at the bottom of the block, but its still stuck there.

Black box is a vacuum manifold. Used predominantly for the cruise control system.

Originally posted by irregular defect
Dropped the head off at the machine shop, dropped of some misc parts at the powder coaters. Any tips on cleaning the cylinders/block surface? And WTF is the lower intake still holding on to? What is that black box? I took out the bolts on the back of the intake and the ones at the bottom of the block, but its still stuck there.

There are also two brackets from the block to the IM. Just ditch them, you dont need them.

Also, go to the auto store and get a 3M RED body scuff pad. i used that and some degreaser to clean my block surface.

3n red body pads are good to keep around. Cleans gasket surfaces very very well without removing material.

I guess I'm just worried about shit falling in the cracks of the block. I'll try that out though, thanks. This is my first kind of in-dept engine work at all, so I'm learning as I go and reading a lot and trying to gain as much knowledge as I can. Every time I go down and work on the car, I bring my laptop with me and I always end up coming here and searching for an answer and 98% of the time I can find it. 2GNT has been amazing.